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Discussion Forum => Question & Answers (Ask any question here) => Topic started by: s.syed on October 25, 2010, 10:26:27 AM



Title: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: s.syed on October 25, 2010, 10:26:27 AM
Assalam Alaikum,
        To wish a non muslim in his/her  festival is that ki you are comitting sin/gunnah ?I had heard about it on media ?exactly did not hear the full detail ie logic ?If it is so can plz tell why is it ?


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: rahul_619 on October 25, 2010, 02:59:36 PM
Walaikum as salaam brother,

I will post a few hadith on this topic hope that will help answer u r question and I will also give my personal opinion


The Prophet, sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam, said: "Whoever imitates a nation is but one of them." [Abu Daawood]
 
Anas, may Allaah be pleased with him, reported: "The Prophet, sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam, came to Madeenah while they had two days they celebrated. The Prophet, sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam, asked, "What are these two days?" They said, 'These are two days we used to celebrate in our pre Islamic era. The Prophet, sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam, said: "Allaah has replaced them with two better days: 'Eed Al-Adh-Haa and 'Eed Al- Fitr." A person came to the Prophet, sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam, and said: "I have taken a vow to sacrifice a camel at Buwaanah.” The Prophet, sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam, asked: “Did the place contain any idol worshipped in Jaahiliyyah (pre-Islamic times)?” They (the people) said: “No.” He asked: “Was any pre-Islamic festival observed there?” They replied: “No.” The Prophet, sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam, said: “Fulfil your vow, for a vow to do an act of disobedience to Allaah must not be fulfilled, neither must one do something over which a human being has no control."

and my personal opinion is that we can wish them as long as the festival is nothing wrong like mother`s day father`s day labour day etc etc but maybe if they would invite me 2 a feast of another religion maybe I would go but not do anything harram or kufar then Insha Allah they might ask me y i m not doin it then maybe i will try to make them understand y i cannot and hope maybe they will understand to maybe

Hope I answered u r question


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Talib-E-ILM on October 25, 2010, 03:09:48 PM
Brother this is a very tricky questions as different scholars hold different views some are of the opinion that one can wish and some say you cannot wish..

In such Tricky Situations i listen to my commonsense and judge myself and follow a very Famous Quranic Ayaat and Hadees which says

Every Person will be judged according to his Intentions (Niyat).

If my real intention is just to maintain cordial relationships with my colleagues and friends then i don't have to worry as I would be judged by my intention
and to maintain peaceful relationship with friends and colleagues is a sunnah of our prophet  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam

If there is Nothing against the sharia and nothing which involves shirk I dont mind wishing my colleagues to maintain peaceful and cordial relations.
But if it goes against the sharia then i avoid it..

If you wanna know what Tahirul Qadri has to say and do visit this video...
Tahir-Ul-Qadri Barelwi Celebrating Christmas reply (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyIx3ATAxbo#)


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: rahul_619 on October 25, 2010, 03:13:44 PM
gud reply brother


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: arsh1226 on October 25, 2010, 03:21:47 PM
Assalamalaikum,,

As mentioned by Imran bhai ,Hazrath  Tahirul Qadri saheb( qibla huzoor) himself promotes of wishing the non muslims TO PROMOTE ISLAM IN A RIGHT MANNER AS WE ALL KNOW HOW ISLAM IS HIGH JACKED BY GEW.

ISLAM IS A RELIGION OF PEACE AND THE SUNNAH IS ALWAYS TO PROMOTE PEACE .


Every Person will be judged by his Intentions (Niyat) VERY TRUE .



MUSIC IS HARAM ,AND THEIR ARE SO MANY WORDS WHICH LEADS TO SHIRK,PEOPLE ARE LEAST BOTHERED ABOUT THAT ,

 BUT WHEN IT COMES TO PROMOTING PEACE PEOPLE PASS FATWAS.

ALLAH HAFIZ






Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Soldier of Islam on October 25, 2010, 03:30:33 PM
Before you jump to any conclusion..

There is another side of the coin also brother..
If u wish Merry Christmas to anyone you should know what merry christmas means..

Christians celebrate Christmas bcoz they Belive that Jesus was born on that day and Jesus  Peace and Blessings Be Upon Him  is son of GOD...
If you are wishing them on this Day means you are also Believing in what they Beleive
(Tat is Jesus ws born on 25th DECEMBER and He was the SON OF GOD)  - Beliving this is HARAAM it is SHIRK.

or If you are NOT believing then you are Supporting their Belief which again is HARAAM.

Tell your christian friends that instead of celebrating on 25th Dec celebrate it on 10 Dec..will they agree they will say NO.
Bcoz its their BELIEF.


But if you dont know what Christmas stands for and if you wish then you can be excused
But if you know exactly what it means and then if you wish its HARAAM..


My View is that To maintain cordial relationships there are many other ways..
To Reach and Do something GOOD You dont need to ADOPT ways that are wrong..









Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Altaf Sultani on October 25, 2010, 03:55:57 PM
walaikum asssalaam bro,

its not a sin..........


Allah Almighty says: (Allah does not forbid you to deal justly and kindly with those who fought not against you on account of religion and did not drive you out of your homes. Verily, Allah loves those who deal with equity. It is only as regards those who fought against you on account of religion, and have driven you out of your homes, and helped to drive you out, that Allah forbids you to befriend them. And whosoever will befriend them, then such are the wrong-doers.) (Al-Mumtahinah 60: 8-9)


From the above verses its clear that v shoud deal with peace with non muslims who interact and deal with muslims in peace.......and vice versa




Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Rizwan Maniar on October 26, 2010, 09:32:23 AM
4 Imran Rahat Shaikh n other members


Tahirul Qadri is not a hujjat in islam, so posting videos of Tahirul qadri serves no purpose, infact a large no. of ulema has termed Tahirul Qadri as ''GUMRAH''

Coming back to the point if u praise or utter such words in front of a non muslim in the way that that particular non muslim or 4 that matter any non muslim feels/considers his/her religion to be a good one , THIS IS STRICTLY PROHIBITED IN ISLAM.


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mamqasmi on October 26, 2010, 11:09:21 AM
Brother Rizwan, bilkul aap nay sahih farmaya magar yeh zaroori to nahen k unko wish karnay k liye aap unki taqreebaat main shamil hoon aur cake bhe katain - jab k aapko pata hay k woh cake MARRY CHRISTMAS k naam pay hay (aur MARRY CHRISTMAS kehna bhe shirk hay lehaza iska cake katna wala khud yeh dekh lay k woh kia kar raha hay) Ulama e Kiram ko to khaas tor pay is nazuk aur pur fitan daur main is baat ka khaas khayal karna chahiye k kahen hamaray is amal say logon ko ungli uthanay k mauqa nahen mil jaye.

Brother - Islam main TAQWA ki bunyaad isi waja say hay baaz cheezain insaan ko burayee ki taraf nahen lay jateen magar beherhaal un cheezon say bach kar aap Allah Kareem k nazdeek qubool tar hojatay hain.

Non Muslims ko agar koyee wish karna chahta hay to zaroor wish karay by sms - letter - card but bilkul aisay jaisa aap nay apni post main likha k SHARAYEE mamlaat k samnay rakh kar k koyee cheez aisi na hojaye k jis say TAJDEED E IMAAN O TAJDEED E NIKAH ki zarorat pesh ajaye.




Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Talib-E-ILM on October 26, 2010, 11:18:57 AM
Brother Rizwan, bilkul aap nay sahih farmaya magar yeh zaroori to nahen k unko wish karnay k liye aap unki taqreebaat main shamil hoon aur cake bhe katain - jab k aapko pata hay k woh cake MARRY CHRISTMAS k naam pay hay (aur MARRY CHRISTMAS kehna bhe shirk hay lehaza iska cake katna wala khud yeh dekh lay k woh kia kar raha hay) Ulama e Kiram ko to khaas tor pay is nazuk aur pur fitan daur main is baat ka khaas khayal karna chahiye k kahen hamaray is amal say logon ko ungli uthanay k mauqa nahen mil jaye.

Brother - Islam main TAQWA ki bunyaad isi waja say hay baaz cheezain insaan ko burayee ki taraf nahen lay jateen magar beherhaal un cheezon say bach kar aap Allah Kareem k nazdeek qubool tar hojatay hain.

Non Muslims ko agar koyee wish karna chahta hay to zaroor wish karay by sms - letter - card but bilkul aisay jaisa aap nay apni post main likha k SHARAYEE mamlaat k samnay rakh kar k koyee cheez aisi na hojaye k jis say TAJDEED E IMAAN O TAJDEED E NIKAH ki zarorat pesh ajaye.



Agreed...


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: arsh1226 on October 26, 2010, 01:35:28 PM
Tahirul Qadri is not a hujjat in islam, so posting videos of Tahirul qadri serves no purpose, infact a large no. of ulema has termed Tahirul Qadri as ''GUMRAH''

Coming back to the point if u praise or utter such words in front of a non muslim in the way that that particular non muslim or 4 that matter any non muslim feels/considers his/her religion to be a good one , THIS IS STRICTLY PROHIBITED IN ISLAM.
 
 
People who consider shakul islam Dr.Tahirul Qadri(saheb)  as''GUMRAH'' are themselves .''GUMRAH'',,,

as far as the Hujjat ul islam ,stop it brother , its yours words or someonelse but its sound arrogant.

 Before posting any comments on shakyul islam Dr.Tahirul Qadri(saheb) make sure you understand what message he delivers and how qualified he is.



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mamqasmi on October 26, 2010, 02:08:35 PM
Brothers actually we are discussing matter here not Dr. Tahir ul Qadri Sahab

But I wanna share something about him -

Dr. Tahir ul Qadri Sahab Damat Barkatuhumul Aalia is a true Sunni and Aashiq e Rasool Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam and the follower in Qadri Silsila - Kuch unkay baray main Ulama e Ahle Sunnat ka ikhtilaaf zaroor hay but unki khidmat e deen ko sab honour kartay hain - And please note k Ulama e Kiram (talking for only Ahle Sunnat) ka aapas main ikhtilaf ummat k liye buhut zaroori hay jis say maslon ka hal nikalta hay -

Dr. Sahab khidmat e deen k hawalay say buhut kaam kar rahay hain aur abhe jo unki ahadees ki kitabain market main aayeen hain uskay liye woh taqreeban tamam dunya main ghoom kar ahadees ka khazana jama karnay main kaamyaab huwe hain aur hazrat ki kitabon main khaas baat yeh hay k mustanad ahadees k hawalay diye hotay hain jo k aajkal bad mazhab logon say baat karnay k liye buhut zaroori hain

Beherhaal what we can do is ---------- k achchi aur mustanad baat jahan say milay wahan say get karkay faida uthao kyun k ilm kisi ki meeraas nahen - jin baton main Ulama e Haq ka un say ikhtilaf hay bus unsay bachain


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Kabir Das on October 26, 2010, 02:17:16 PM
Quote
Beherhaal what we can do is ---------- k achchi aur mustanad baat jahan say milay wahan say get karkay faida uthao kyun k ilm kisi ki meeraas nahen - jin baton main Ulama e Haq ka un say ikhtilaf hay bus unsay bachain

Very Well said..


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: arsh1226 on October 26, 2010, 02:41:18 PM
Brothers actually we are discussing matter here not Dr. Tahir ul Qadri Sahab

But I wanna share something about him -

Dr. Tahir ul Qadri Sahab Damat Barkatuhumul Aalia is a true Sunni and Aashiq e Rasool Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam and the follower in Qadri Silsila - Kuch unkay baray main Ulama e Ahle Sunnat ka ikhtilaaf zaroor hay but unki khidmat e deen ko sab honour kartay hain - And please note k Ulama e Kiram (talking for only Ahle Sunnat) ka aapas main ikhtilaf ummat k liye buhut zaroori hay jis say maslon ka hal nikalta hay -

Dr. Sahab khidmat e deen k hawalay say buhut kaam kar rahay hain aur abhe jo unki ahadees ki kitabain market main aayeen hain uskay liye woh taqreeban tamam dunya main ghoom kar ahadees ka khazana jama karnay main kaamyaab huwe hain aur hazrat ki kitabon main khaas baat yeh hay k mustanad ahadees k hawalay diye hotay hain jo k aajkal bad mazhab logon say baat karnay k liye buhut zaroori hain

Beherhaal what we can do is ---------- k achchi aur mustanad baat jahan say milay wahan say get karkay faida uthao kyun k ilm kisi ki meeraas nahen - jin baton main Ulama e Haq ka un say ikhtilaf hay bus unsay bachain  
 
 

well said bhai,,,,lets not criticize any alim,,,lets keep quite if we dont agree or understand the matter.


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Ajmal Siddiquie on October 26, 2010, 02:50:27 PM
Quote
Coming back to the point if u praise or utter such words in front of a non muslim in the way that that particular non muslim or 4 that matter any non muslim feels/considers his/her religion to be a good one , THIS IS STRICTLY PROHIBITED IN ISLAM

This is exactly True also I agree with Soldier of Islam saying that....

Quote
My View is that To maintain cordial relationships there are many other ways..
To Reach and Do something GOOD You dont need to ADOPT ways that are wrong..


Chori ke Paison se Khairaat nai kee Jaati..

Kisi bhi achi cheez ko karne k liye Galat Tareeqe apnaaye nahi jaasakte...



Aur Tahir ul Qadri sahab k jazbon ki bhi ham qadr karte hain magr koi baatein jo hame hazam nai hotin usko chod dena chaiyen..


Baaqi hame is behans me nai padna chaiye...aur Atif bhai ne badi achi baat kahi hai jisse pta chalta hai k wo kitne Danishmand aur Akalmand insaan hain...

Quote

k achchi aur mustanad baat jahan say milay wahan say get karkay faida uthao kyun k ilm kisi ki meeraas nahen - jin baton main Ulama e Haq ka un say ikhtilaf hay bus unsay bachain

I remember a hadees where Rasool Allah  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam had said agar Ilm haasil karne k liye Cheen tak bhi jaana pde to jaao...



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: ghaws786 on November 01, 2010, 02:29:16 PM
As-salamu-alaikum All,

This is my first post on this forum and I am not sure whether it will pass through the moderators or not. But I hope for the best.

I have checked out each and every comment on this topic and came to the conclusion that there are many misunderstandings and MISAPPLICATIONS of Quranic Verses and Prophetic hadith quoted during the discussion, which I will try to resolve Insha-Allah with the help of Allah( Subhana wa taaala) and HIS blessed Prophet Muhammad(SAW)

Before I start, I would like to make a request to each and everyone reading this reply; not to place any bad comment on ANY of the scholars from now on; who is working for ISLAM. I don't want to name anyone, but the reason for this act is that once we start abusing about any servant of Islam; Allah( Subhana wa taaala) will lift HIS blessings and BARAKAT from the knowledge which we are about to acquire.

With said this; I would go directly to the topic of celebrating from the text of Qura'n. Anyone can open up the Qura'n and check out the verse of celebration given by Allah( Subhana wa taaala) in Sura Yunus Verse no. 58

    Qul bifadli Allahi wabirahmatihi fabithalika falyafrahoo huwa khayrun mimma yajmaAAoona

    10:58 Say: "In the bounty of Allah. And in His Mercy,- in that let them rejoice": that is better than the (wealth) they HOARD.

This verse gives us the concept of celebration in Islam. While going into the tafseer of this verse; it clearly says that any occasion on which Allah( Subhana wa taaala) has put HIS blessings and Mercy; you are allowed to celebrate. And this celebration is much better than the money you save. So technically any function which involves the acts of haraam or which leads towards wrath of Allah( Subhana wa taaala) should be prohibited; and anything which leads towards love and Mercy should be celebrated.

Another tafseer of this verse is that; this verse has specifically been sent down by Allah( Subhana wa taaala) for us to celebrate the BIRTHS of HIS prophets. This does not differentiate between any Prophet starting from Adam( Alaihis Salaam ) up to beloved Prophet Muhammad(saw). Now, if anyone does not celebrate the BIRTH of Prophet ISA( Alaihis Salaam ) its their own choice; but this is not what Allah( Subhana wa taaala) desired. The concept is just to look at all those acts which are involved while celebration. Are they Halal or haraam? If you don't find any haraam act in celebration; we are allowed to celebrate such functions.

Now TWO questions remain Pending on the birth of Isa( Alaihis Salaam )

1. Whether we should celebrate it on DEC-25 or not?
2. Whether we should Wish Christians on Dec-25 or not?

Coming to the first question: Celebrate it on Dec-25. I don't see any act of Haraam [A Haraam act is Any act prohibited by Allah( Subhana wa taaala) in the text of Qur'an or by the Prophet Muhammad(SAW) in the text of Hadis] or
SHIRK[A Shirk act is Any act which contradicts with the WORSHIP of Allah( Subhana wa taaala)] while celebrating it on December 25 or any other day during the year. Remind you all that we celebrate the birth of Prophet Adam
( Alaihis Salaam ) every Friday for the whole year during Friday prayers. [Remind you that Prophet ISA( Alaihis Salaam ) is a Prophet and a Rasool also which is of higher status than Prophet Adam( Alaihis Salaam ) who is just a prophet of Allah( Subhana wa taaala)]

However We should abstain from  the acts of drinking or partying late as Christians do because drinking is haraam from the text of Qura'n and partying late falls under Disapproved category of acts which leads us
away from the happiness of Allah( Subhana wa taaala) and His beloved Prophet Muhammad(saw).

Now, Lets analyze some of the advantages and disadvantages of celebration on Dec-25.

Advantages:
---------------
1. This reduces the gap between Muslims and Christians thereby inviting the Christians to celebrate the birth of our Beloved Prophet Muhammad(saw) on Mawlid-un Nabi(saw) functions.

2. It Promotes the message of Peace and Unity among the two biggest Faiths of the world. This message is of peace is the need of the time today; as we Muslims are labeled as terrorists.

3. It gives Christians the message to learn Islamic Faith and provides us the chance to convert them to true faith of Islam.

Disadvantages:
-------------

1. The only disadvantage which I can see is that Muslims should say that we are celebrating Christians function. I would prefer to act on Allah( Subhana wa taaala) commandment instead of bothering about what people should say.

Coming to the second question of Wishing Christians on Dec-25 or not.

Again the answer lies in the fact of checking the act of Wishing anyone. Does it leads us to Shirk- NO; Does it leads us to Haraam?- NO; Does it Leads us to Bid'ah- NO; However it leads us to reducing distance
between the people which is an act of making Allah( Subhana wa taaala) happy.

Remember we wish "Salam" to so many people during the day; this act also leads us to reduce distance. IS salaam restricted to Muslims only? OR can we wish Salaam only to Muslims- NO. We are allowed to send peace on each and every human being irrespective of age, color, creed or faith. This is the  way of Allah( Subhana wa taaala), His beloved Prophet Muhammad(saw) and Aulia Allah.

I hope the above discussion had resolved many misunderstandings and confusions. If there is any doubt pending in the minds; it's most welcome. I pray to Allah( Subhana wa taaala) that He may accept this little effort and
lead us all to Sirat-al- Mustaqeem. Aameen.

Wassalam,
Your brother in Islam.



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mamqasmi on November 01, 2010, 03:04:36 PM
Walaikum Assalaam Wa Rehmatullahi Wa Barakatuhu

This is my first post on this forum and I am not sure whether it will pass through the moderators or not. But I hope for the best.

Marhaba to come with ur first post

I have checked out each and every comment on this topic and came to the conclusion that there are many misunderstandings and MISAPPLICATIONS of Quranic Verses and Prophetic hadith quoted during the discussion, which I will try to resolve Insha-Allah with the help of Allah ( Subhana wa taaala) and HIS blessed Prophet Muhammad(SAW)

Brother this is Islamic forum (truly for Ahle Sunnat wal Jamat aqida) – and u can have a right to express ur feelings – Please to care always right complete Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam instead of SAW – kyun k Ulama e Haq nay isko Be-Adabi k barabar karar diya hay

Before I start, I would like to make a request to each and everyone reading this reply; not to place any bad comment on ANY of the scholars from now on; who is working for ISLAM. I don't want to name anyone, but the reason for this act is that once we start abusing about any servant of Islam; Allah( Subhana wa taaala) will lift HIS blessings and BARAKAT from the knowledge which we are about to acquire.


Brother – no one will give a bad reply because we all here for Islah e Deen but we can express our feelings by knowledge which have got from Aulia Allah – Buzurgan e Deen – Ulama e Haq and Muftiyaan e Ikram by the grace of Almighty Allah that he has given us right path



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mamqasmi on November 01, 2010, 03:23:42 PM
With said this; I would go directly to the topic of celebrating from the text of Qura'n. Anyone can open up the Qura'n and check out the verse of celebration given by Allah( Subhana wa taaala) in Sura Yunus Verse no. 58

    Qul bifadli Allahi wabirahmatihi fabithalika falyafrahoo huwa khayrun mimma yajmaAAoona

    10:58 Say: "In the bounty of Allah. And in His Mercy,- in that let them rejoice": that is better than the (wealth) they HOARD.

This verse gives us the concept of celebration in Islam. While going into the tafseer of this verse; it clearly says that any occasion on which Allah( Subhana wa taaala) has put HIS blessings and Mercy; you are allowed to celebrate. And this celebration is much better than the money you save. So technically any function which involves the acts of haraam or which leads towards wrath of Allah( Subhana wa taaala) should be prohibited; and anything which leads towards love and Mercy should be celebrated.

Another tafseer of this verse is that; this verse has specifically been sent down by Allah( Subhana wa taaala) for us to celebrate the BIRTHS of HIS prophets. This does not differentiate between any Prophet starting from Adam( Alaihis Salaam ) up to beloved Prophet Muhammad(saw). Now, if anyone does not celebrate the BIRTH of Prophet ISA( Alaihis Salaam ) its their own choice; but this is not what Allah( Subhana wa taaala) desired. The concept is just to look at all those acts which are involved while celebration. Are they Halal or haraam? If you don't find any haraam act in celebration; we are allowed to celebrate such functions.

Now TWO questions remain Pending on the birth of Isa( Alaihis Salaam )

1. Whether we should celebrate it on DEC-25 or not?
2. Whether we should Wish Christians on Dec-25 or not?

Coming to the first question: Celebrate it on Dec-25. I don't see any act of Haraam [A Haraam act is Any act prohibited by Allah( Subhana wa taaala) in the text of Qur'an or by the Prophet Muhammad(SAW) in the text of Hadis] or
SHIRK[A Shirk act is Any act which contradicts with the WORSHIP of Allah( Subhana wa taaala)] while celebrating it on December 25 or any other day during the year. Remind you all that we celebrate the birth of Prophet Adam
( Alaihis Salaam ) every Friday for the whole year during Friday prayers. [Remind you that Prophet ISA( Alaihis Salaam ) is a Prophet and a Rasool also which is of higher status than Prophet Adam( Alaihis Salaam ) who is just a prophet of Allah( Subhana wa taaala)]

However We should abstain from  the acts of drinking or partying late as Christians do because drinking is haraam from the text of Qura'n and partying late falls under Disapproved category of acts which leads us
away from the happiness of Allah( Subhana wa taaala) and His beloved Prophet Muhammad(saw).

Now, Lets analyze some of the advantages and disadvantages of celebration on Dec-25.

Brother – This ayat’s urdu meaning (by Kanzul Iman of Ala Hazrat Alaih Rehma) is

TUM FARMAO ALLAH HE K FAZAL AUR USI KI REHMAT AUR USI PAR CHAHIYE K KHUSHI KARAIN

Brother – Chunkay Quran e Majeed ka tarjuma buhut say logon nay kia hay aur uski tafseer bhe apni apni aql k mutabiq ki hay lehaz har aik ka alag alag view hota hay Tafseer main magar main aapko is ayat ki mukhtasir tafseer pesh kar raha hoon

KISI MEHBOOB YA PIYARI CHEEZ KO PANAY YA HASIL KARNAY SAY DIL KO JO LAZZAT HOTI HAY USKO FARAH KEHTAY HAIN AUR MEANINGS YEH HAIN K IMAAN WALON KO ALLAH K FAZL O REHMAT PAR KHUSH HONA CHAHIYE K USNAY UNHAIN MAWA’IZ AUR SHAFA SUDOOR AUR IMAAN K SAATH DIL KI RAHAT O SUKOON ATA FARMAYE

Aur is ayat k mutaliq Hazrat Ibn e Abbas Razi Allaho Anho aur Hazrat Hasan Razi Allaho Anho aur Hazrat Qatadah Razi Allaho Anho nay farmaya hay k

ALLAH K FAZAL SAY ISLAM AUR USKI REHMAT SAY QURAN E PAK MURAD HAY

Aur aik aur qaul k mutabiq

FAZAL ALLAH SAY QURAN AUR REHMAT SAY AHADEES MARVI HAIN

Brother – is tafseer aur Ahadees say pata chalta hay k kis khushi ko celebrate karna hay aur kis tarah say karna – main yeh nahen kehta k kisi non muslim ki khushi ko celebrate nahen karo but masla yeh hay k isko celebrate karnay main kahen hum say koyee sharee ghalati sadir na hojaye yani jaisa k MERRY CHRISTMAS kehna shirk hay jis k lugwi maanay main yeh hay k Na’aa’ouzobillah Allah nay beta jana – to agar koyee celebration karnay main yeh kehday to Tajdeed e Islam aur Tajdeed Nikah karna parta hay yani aap Islam say kharij hosaktay hain

Isi tarah aapnay baaz auqaat dekha hoga k Cricket main Australian ya English team win karnay baad Sharab (Vine) khool kar celebrate karti hay to kia aisa karna kisi musalmaan k liye sahih hoga? Magar iskay bar aks aap unko unki jeet ki khushi main mubarakbaad zaroor day saktay hain

Huzoor Nabi e Kareem Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam apni wildat k din ko celebrate karnay k liye Monday ko roza rakhtay thay – simple isi tarah agar aapko Aqa Kareem Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam k milad sharif k ilawa agar Hazrat Isa Alaihay Salaam ya Hazrat Ibrahim Alaihay Salaam ya koyee bhe Ambia Kiram ki wiladat ki khushi manani hay to unki wiladat k din roza rakhain ya Quran Khawani karain milad ka intizam karain na k khaas taur pay Church main jakar celebrate karain



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mamqasmi on November 01, 2010, 03:36:54 PM
Advantages:
---------------
1. This reduces the gap between Muslims and Christians thereby inviting the Christians to celebrate the birth of our Beloved Prophet Muhammad(saw) on Mawlid-un Nabi(saw) functions

Meray aik sawaal ka jawaab dain k Non Muslims say pehlay to hamain un logon ko is amal pay lana chahiye jo musalmaan hotay huwe bhe isko nahen maantay – I mean Bad Aqida Deobandi – Ahl e Hadess etc jo Sarkar e Do Alam Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam k milad sharif ko nahen maantay – pehlay to hamara qadam yeh hona chahiye k Musalmanon main agar koyee is cheez say inkaar karay to usko samjhain na k Non Muslims jinka yeh Aqida ho k Maaz Allah – Hazrat Isa Alaihay Salaam, Allah Kareem k betay (son) hain

2. It Promotes the message of Peace and Unity among the two biggest Faiths of the world. This message is of peace is the need of the time today; as we Muslims are labeled as terrorists.

There are so many other ways to promote message of Peace and unity k agar Non Muslim kisi mushkil main hay to usko aap mushkil say nikal dain ya uski maali madad kardain kyun hum to unko maantay hain jinkay dar say koye ekhali haath na louta kabhe

YEH DARBA E MOHAMMAD HAY YEHAN APNON KA KIYA KEHNA
YEHAN SAY HAATH KHALI GHAIR BHE JAYA NAHEN KARTAY

3. It gives Christians the message to learn Islamic Faith and provides us the chance to convert them to true faith of Islam.

Dear brother – chunkay Quran e Majeed maujood hay aur hamain yeh bhe pata hay k Non Muslims nay Quran e Majeed parh kar is say kitna faida hasil kia hay magar Allah Kareem nay chunkay unkay gardnaon main tauq daal diye hain (yani hidayat nahen di) is liye woh log gumrah hain – aur beshak Hidayat Allah Kareem he ki taraf say hay –

Hum Musalmaan aaj kal jo pasti ka shikaar hain woh is liye hay hum nay apnay amal ko Quran o Sunnah k tariqon say karna chor diya hay – Jhoot hum boltay hain – Gheebat hum kartay hain – Janwaron k saath badsulloki hum kartay – musalmanon ko hum martay hain – Sood aur Rsihwat say hum log juray hain – Husn e Ikhlaq say hum log gir gaye hain – agar sirf in cheezon ko doobarah pakar lain to Non Muslims sirf hamaray achchay amal ko dekh kar bhe Muslim hosaktay hain



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Soldier of Islam on November 01, 2010, 04:04:41 PM
Brother first of all welcome to the forum, and its nice to have someone who reads the posts and comments so carefully and then writes his view such detail which you have done..really appreciate it..BUT

Quote
 Qul bifadli Allahi wabirahmatihi fabithalika falyafrahoo huwa khayrun mimma yajmaAAoona
10:58 Say: "In the bounty of Allah. And in His Mercy,- in that let them rejoice": that is better than the (wealth) they HOARD.

Brother i dont know whose Translation are you referring to please check who has done the Translation is he a SUNNI or a Wahabi.
We Ahle Sunnat wal Jamaat follow only the Translation done by ALAA Hazrat  (Radiallahu Ta’ala Anhu).
and his Translation says..Also read in context.

[Yunus 10:56] And He gives life and gives death, and towards Him you will return.
[Yunus 10:57] O mankind! The advice has come to you from your Lord and a cure for the hearts - and guidance and mercy for believers.
[Yunus 10:58] Say, “Upon Allah’s munificence and upon His mercy - upon these should the people rejoice”; that is better than all their wealth and possessions.
[Yunus 10:59] Say, "What is your opinion - (regarding) the sustenance that Allah has sent down for you? So you have, on your own, deemed lawful and unlawful in it!"; say, "Has Allah given you permission for it, or do you fabricate a lie against Allah?"
[Yunus 10:60] And what do they, who fabricate lies against Allah, assume will be their state on the Day of Resurrection? Indeed Allah is Most Munificent upon mankind, but most people are not thankful.

If you read in context you will notice that ALLAH (Subhana wa taaala). is only talking about himself and his bouty. Nowhere does it mention any other Prophet...

Now what does "munificence"  : The quality or state of being generous: big-heartedness, bounteousness, bountifulness, freehandedness, generosity, generousness, great-heartedness, large-heartedness, lavishness, liberality, magnanimity, magnanimousness, openhandedness, unselfishness, unsparingness.

There is NO MENTION of Celebrating the Birth of Any prophets in this VERSE. Allah is asking you to be Happy and Rejoice his Bouteousness, His Generosity and his Qualities.

Quote
There are many misunderstandings and MISAPPLICATIONS of Quranic Verses and Prophetic hadith quoted during the discussion, which I will try to resolve Insha-Allah with the help of Allah( Subhana wa taaala) and HIS blessed Prophet Muhammad(SAW)

You have proved your point here too..

Moreover if you want to Celebrate the Birth of Isa  Alaihis Salaam . then why do you choose 25 Decemeber? is it mentioned in Any Hadees or Any Aalim has given any Fatwaa that the Birth was on 25th Decemeber? and why you choose to celebrate with the NON MUSLIMS...if u wanna celebrarte stay in ur home..Do Nyaaz, Do Fateha.. Do Fasting...

Brother You have listed Advantages and Disadvantages but here i would like to list one most important one which you missed..

1. If A scholar of Islam starts visiting and celebrating parties with NON MUSLIMS the innocent muslims will start thinking it to be right..
and they will also start visiting their parties and celebrations..And the whole world knows what goes on in Christmas parties. Wine, Dance, Music is a Necessity there.
May be The SCHOLAR may be saved from all this FITNA but the Innocent Ummah who is following him how will they be saved...And who will be responsible for it...?

A SCHOLAR has to set a ROLE MODEL in front of his followers by cutting down the ROOTS of ANY FITNA that may arise...

Their are many other ways of increasing peace and universal brotherhood...It wont be increased by you eating cakes and shaking hands with them in their parties.

Coming back to the point if u praise or utter such words in front of a non muslim in the way that that particular non muslim or 4 that matter any non muslim feels/considers his/her religion to be a good one , THIS IS STRICTLY PROHIBITED IN ISLAM.


Out of your whole post I can agree with you only on this one point with which you started.

Quote
Before I start, I would like to make a request to each and everyone reading this reply; not to place any bad comment on ANY of the scholars from now on; who is working for ISLAM. I don't want to name anyone, but the reason for this act is that once we start abusing about any servant of Islam; Allah( Subhana wa taaala) will lift HIS blessings and BARAKAT from the knowledge which we are about to acquire.

Rest all according to me is just Interpretation of Quran to justify ones own action thats all.


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Raziya Warsi on November 01, 2010, 05:12:06 PM
Quote
Hum Musalmaan aaj kal jo pasti ka shikaar hain woh is liye hay hum nay apnay amal ko Quran o Sunnah k tariqon say karna chor diya hay – Jhoot hum boltay hain – Gheebat hum kartay hain – Janwaron k saath badsulloki hum kartay – musalmanon ko hum martay hain – Sood aur Rsihwat say hum log juray hain – Husn e Ikhlaq say hum log gir gaye hain – agar sirf in cheezon ko doobarah pakar lain to Non Muslims sirf hamaray achchay amal ko dekh kar bhe Muslim hosaktay hain

Bahot sahi kahaa Qasmi bhaai Aapne...

Musalmaan ka Qirdaar itna acha ho k log usko dekhkar musalmaan banne ki chahat se musalmaan hojayeein..

I want to ask Hazrat Khwaja Garib Nawaaz  (Radiallahu Ta’ala Anhu). kabhi Koi XMAS party me gaye the..?
Kabhi kisi Hindu ki Diwaali me Gaye the..?

Kya Kabhi Alaa Hazrat  (Radiallahu Ta’ala Anhu)., Waris Paak  (Radiallahu Ta’ala Anhu)., Gaus Paak  (Radiallahu Ta’ala Anhu)., Makhdoom Sarkaar  (Radiallahu Ta’ala Anhu)...Kya kabhi koi bhi Buzurgaane deen ne yeh tareeka apnaaya tha Dusre Musalmaanon ko Islam Qubool karwaane k liye...

Answer is a BIG NOOOOO

so why now......

Apne Ikhlaaq ko aisa bnaalo k log tumhe Dekhkar Musalmaan hojayein..Afsos wohi ham bhool chuke hain...aur apni hi mastiyon me gum hain


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mamqasmi on November 01, 2010, 05:46:54 PM
Disadvantages:
-------------

1. The only disadvantage which I can see is that Muslims should say that we are celebrating Christians function. I would prefer to act on Allah( Subhana wa taaala) commandment instead of bothering about what people should say.

Coming to the second question of Wishing Christians on Dec-25 or not.

Again the answer lies in the fact of checking the act of Wishing anyone. Does it leads us to Shirk- NO; Does it leads us to Haraam?- NO; Does it Leads us to Bid'ah- NO; However it leads us to reducing distance
between the people which is an act of making Allah( Subhana wa taaala) happy.

Brother – do u exactly know what the meaning of Christmas? Aur kyun celebrate kiya jata hay

Tafseel to yeh k aam zabaan main Hazrat Isa Alaihay Salaam ki wiladat ko celebrate karna magar iski bareeki main ja’in to Non Muslims ka yeh aqida hay k Maaz Allah – Hazrat Isa Alaihay Salaam – Allah Kareem k betay (son) hain – aur yeh shirk k barabar hay

Baaz auqaat upper ki cheez buhut saaf suthri hoti hay magar iskay andar k nuqsanaat buhut kharaab hotay hain

Remember we wish "Salam" to so many people during the day; this act also leads us to reduce distance. IS salaam restricted to Muslims only? OR can we wish Salaam only to Muslims- NO. We are allowed to send peace on each and every human being irrespective of age, color, creed or faith. This is the  way of Allah( Subhana wa taaala), His beloved Prophet Muhammad(saw) and Aulia Allah.

Non Muslims ko salaam karna mana hay Hadees Sharif say – Please note

Huzoor Pur Noor Faiz e Ganjoor Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam nay farmaya k

AGAR AHL E KITAB (YAHOOD O NASARA) MAIN SAY KOI TUMHAIN SALAAM KARAY TO JAWAB MAIN KAHO WA ALAIK (only)

Kyun k walaikum assalaam kehnay say aap unpar salamti bhejaingay aur salamti sirf musalmanoon k liye hay k jab tak yahood o nasara main say koi islam qubool na karlay salamti nahen hosakti unpar.

http://kgn786.com/forum/index.php/topic,2841.0.html (http://kgn786.com/forum/index.php/topic,2841.0.html)

I hope the above discussion had resolved many misunderstandings and confusions. If there is any doubt pending in the minds; it's most welcome. I pray to Allah( Subhana wa taaala) that He may accept this little effort and
lead us all to Sirat-al- Mustaqeem. Aameen.

Ameen – Ya Rabbal Aalameen



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mamqasmi on November 02, 2010, 10:18:20 AM
Iskay ilawa agar aap aik aur Sahabi e Kiram Ajmayeen ka yeh qaul mubarak dekhain jismain

Hazrat Abdullah bin Umar Razi Allaho Anho nay farmaya k

SHARAB peenay walon ko salaam na karo

hosakta hay k Musalmaan bhe gunah kartay huwe sharab peetay hoon but Non Muslims to har waqt sharab k nashay main he miltay hain kyun k un logon k haan iski haisiyat pani ki tarah hay to ab aap andaza karlain k kyun unko salaam karna sahih nahen hay

http://kgn786.com/forum/index.php/topic,7736.0.html (http://kgn786.com/forum/index.php/topic,7736.0.html)


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: ghaws786 on November 02, 2010, 08:26:23 PM
As-salamu-alaikum All,

Thanks for your comments…and most importantly brother with the ID: mamqasmi. I think you have read my post very carefully..and replied to the best of your knowledge. Thanks for that…this is how we spread knowledge among people who are reading these posts.

But before replying to his queries…I would take the queries of brother with ID: Soldier of Islam…

Brother if you take Ala hazrat( (Rahmatullahi Allaih))  translation also… the meaning of the verse remains the same..As you mentioned it

“Upon Allah’s munificence and upon His mercy - upon these should the people rejoice”; that is better than all their wealth and possessions.”

Now whatever meaning you take for the word “Munifience” from the list you have provided; My question to you is that Do you think that the Birth of Prophets is Allah’s Mercy on Human beings or NOT?

If it is Allah’s Mercy on us then the discussion is over. We should celebrate it.

Secondly you have said a very important point that a Scholar of Islam is a role Model for the Ummah, I would further add to your point of view; that if a scholar starts doing anything which is against the shariah Law then that scholar is responsible for the sins of everyone also who follows him.

However on the other hand if he does not act according to Shariah Law then he is breaching the Legacy of prophets and he is responsible for that also. A true scholar has no way to escape except to follow the Sharia law to save him from the hellfire.

If he acts according to the shariah Law, doesn’t care about what the people say, and leave a message for the ummah then that scholar is elevated in Status by Allah( Subhana wa taaala) and  the benefit of all those acts of the people whoever follows him goes to that scholar also.

That is the reason why This scholar (Dr. Muhammad Tahir ul Qadri) celebrated the birth of Prophet Isa( Alaihis Salaam ) in the premises of Minhaj ul Qur’an itself. He never went to their place to celebrate it among them. And the benefit of this is that from then onwards many christens started to join the festivities of Milad un Nabi(saw). You can check out many videos of these festivities where the christen preachers were sitting on the stage and their followers were sitting in the public. This is What Islam stands for.

At last I want to say that you missed the point in your last statement about eating cake and shaking hands. Again my question to you is that;  Is eating cake Prohibited in Islam?  YES/NO?
IS Shaking hands with non Muslims is Prohibited in Islam? YES/NO?  If your answer is NO then I hope I answered your questions. If your answer is Yes then I would say PROVE IT.
Rest I should Leave on Allah( Subhana wa taaala) and His beloved Prophet Muhammad(saw) to guide us.

Wassalam
Your brother in Islam.


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Soldier of Islam on November 02, 2010, 09:13:42 PM
Walikum Assalaam Wa Rehamtullahe Wa Barkathu. brother Ghaws786 and all,

I personally listen to Dr Sahab and like his lectures very much but one cannot agree to these acts. But still we continue to listen to His Lectures and Refer to his Articles whenever needed to answer the Wahabis. This proves that i really respect him for the work he has done and for his Knowledge But again Galti to Insaan se hi hoti hai. At times listening to him makes my eyes Wet and your heart gets filled with Love and Respect for our AAQA  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam

But again one cannot base his Opinion on the Sayings of a person He has to base it his opinion on his ACTIONS.


What i think is what you are trying to do is Justify wrong actions of somebody by manipulating the Meaning of Verses of Quran according to your own needs.

Read in context of the Ayat and you will understand that Nowhere Prophets is mentioned.

And still if you Assume Celebration of Prophets is mentioned then why only celebrate Prophet Isa's  Alaihis Salaam . Bday..
Celebrate Musa  Alaihis Salaam . bday also..celebrate Ayub  Alaihis Salaam . bday and all 25 prophets mentioned in the QURAN.

Also why you choose 25 Dec for it Only bcoz Non Muslims are doing it and you will get a bigger Audience..?

Brother You may have celebrated it in your house within the premises of Minhajul Quran. But what about the Innocent MUSLIMS. they may think it to be good..
and Go and celebrate it out with their friends and in churches in schools colleges. And everybody knows what happens in this parties. The thing is that you may have just Eaten a cake and shook hands but what about innocent muslims..They will go Dance..listen to music ..drink wine and all that things you are well aware of..


In your Zeal to capture a wider Audience and get the Benefits from the Non Muslims you have IGNORED the Hadees of Prophet Muhammed  (sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam), That You should NOT IMITATE the NON MUSLIMS...and celebrating Christmas is an Act of Non Muslims no one can deny it.

The Prophet, sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam, said: "Whoever imitates a nation is but one of them." [Abu Daawood]

To celebrate the Birth of Prophet Isa..Do Khatmul Quran.. Keep a fast.. Feed the Hungry...and many other things..

Did Prophet Muhammed  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam ever in his Life Once celebrate the Birth of Prophet ISA  Alaihis Salaam . on 25the DECEMBER with any NON MUSLIM...?
Can you produce any Hadees where PROPHET Muhammad  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam went to any NON MUSLIM Celebration..?

If not it means its not the Sunnah of our Prophet Muhammad  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam then why is a Person who claims to be the AASHIQ of our prophet ( sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam) going
ahead and doing things he has not done...

Also as rightly asked by sister Raziya Warsi..Did Khwaja Garib Nawaz  (Radiallahu Ta’ala Anhu). who have converted Lakhs of Muslims to Islam did he do any such thing..
Or for that matter any Wali of ALLH or AALIM did he do any such thing in the PAST...

Did they not know about all the Daleels which you are giving...

Or do you think Dr. Sahib is much better Wali and Buzurg then on all the Walis of the Past
and can Innovate new things into ISLAM..?

No Amount of Justification can justify this Act of Celebrating Christmas with Non Muslims.
In my personal opinion this Demands and Apology and a clarification for the Said Scholar.

Hope you understood my point.



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: ghaws786 on November 02, 2010, 09:41:43 PM
Reply for brother with ID: Mamqasmi

I agree to brother saying the word Sallaho Alayhi Wassalam instead of writing  (sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam).  But to make it a habit requires time. So if you read the word SAW in my discussion.. Just read it as Sallaho Alayhi Wassalam. The intention is to respect and love the prophet Sallaho Alayhi Wassalam to the extreme.

Coming directly to the Tafseer presented by brother. You have given me three explanations:

1.   KISI MEHBOOB YA PIYARI CHEEZ KO PANAY YA HASIL KARNAY SAY DIL KO JO LAZZAT HOTI HAY USKO FARAH KEHTAY HAIN AUR MEANINGS YEH HAIN K IMAAN WALON KO ALLAH K FAZL O REHMAT PAR KHUSH HONA CHAHIYE K USNAY UNHAIN MAWA’IZ AUR SHAFA SUDOOR AUR IMAAN K SAATH DIL KI RAHAT O SUKOON ATA FARMAYE

Reasoning: Do you believe that Prophets are beloved of Allah Subhana Wa taala. If they are not beloved;  they should not be prophets. If they are beloved then according to YOUR first Tafseer We feel happy and rejoice on the births of the Prophets; and we should celebrate their births; because they are “Mehboob”, Pyari Cheez, and we feel Farhat.. and that’s why Milaad Manaane se Dil ko farhat aur Sukoon Milta Hai.

2.   Aur is ayat k mutaliq Hazrat Ibn e Abbas Razi Allaho Anho aur Hazrat Hasan Razi Allaho Anho aur Hazrat Qatadah Razi Allaho Anho nay farmaya hay k

ALLAH K FAZAL SAY ISLAM AUR USKI REHMAT SAY QURAN E PAK MURAD HAY

Reasoning: This is also Right. But my question is Can you get Qur’an without the beloved Prophet Muhammad Sallalo Alayhi Wassalam. You Should Say NO. There is no point of escape on this question. Similarly Can you get “Injeel”( Not the present Bible) without Prophet ISA(alayhis Salam). IF you can’t get Allah’s books without the Prophets; then How can you get Allah’s Happiness or Joy OR Farhat Without the Prophets. So you have to believe that the raising of the Prophets is the blessings of Allah Subhana Taala and we should celebrate their births.

Remind you that believing in ACTUAL injeel is a tenant of Faith. A momin has to believe in all four revelations of Allah Subhana wa Taala.

3.   Aur aik aur qaul k mutabiq

FAZAL ALLAH SAY QURAN AUR REHMAT SAY AHADEES MARVI HAIN

Reasonong: I already explained about Qur’an. Again if you take AHadees as rehmat. My question is: Can you get any Ahadees without the Prophet? If No then You should accept that the all your Tafseers leads to the meaning of Raising of the prophets. And the ummah should celebrate their births.

You also mentioned that:

MERRY CHRISTMAS kehna shirk hay jis k lugwi maanay main yeh hay k Na’aa’ouzobillah Allah nay beta jana – to agar koyee celebration karnay main yeh kehday to Tajdeed e Islam aur Tajdeed Nikah karna parta hay yani aap Islam say kharij hosaktay hain

I want to know that Which Category of SHIRK does it fall into?  What is the main category of SHIRK and what is the Subcategory of SHIRK?  If you cannot give the reply on the category of Shirk then I think I should have to Start a topic on the "Definition and categorization of Tauheed and Shirk".

You also said that:

Isi tarah aapnay baaz auqaat dekha hoga k Cricket main Australian ya English team win karnay baad Sharab (Vine) khool kar celebrate karti hay to kia aisa karna kisi musalmaan k liye sahih hoga? Magar iskay bar aks aap unko unki jeet ki khushi main mubarakbaad zaroor day saktay hain

Reasoning: Brother you missed the point here; in my post I have already mentioned to concentrate on the acts which we do. If that act is Haram then we should prohibit the act. Since Wine is Haram; declared by Qur’an there is no use to mention this example.

You also mentioned:

Meray aik sawaal ka jawaab dain k Non Muslims say pehlay to hamain un logon ko is amal pay lana chahiye jo musalmaan hotay huwe bhe isko nahen maantay – I mean Bad Aqida Deobandi – Ahl e Hadess etc jo Sarkar e Do Alam Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam k milad sharif ko nahen maantay – pehlay to hamara qadam yeh hona chahiye k Musalmanon main agar koyee is cheez say inkaar karay to usko samjhain na k Non Muslims jinka yeh Aqida ho k Maaz Allah – Hazrat Isa Alaihay Salaam, Allah Kareem k betay (son) hain

Reasoning: I agree to you and that’s what we are doing through this forum.

You also mentioned:

There are so many other ways to promote message of Peace and unity k agar Non Muslim kisi mushkil main hay to usko aap mushkil say nikal dain ya uski maali madad kardain kyun hum to unko maantay hain jinkay dar say koye ekhali haath na louta kabhe

Answer: Mere bhai.. Aap jisko maante hain..unhone bhi apne dar par NON-Muslims ke aane ko BAN nahi Kiya. Aapne khud kaha ki Unke Dar se KOI bhi khaali nahi Gaya. Aapne Yeh nahi kaha ki Unke Dar se Musalman Khaali nahi gaya. Wo to wafaat ke baad bhi har kisis ko aane ki ijazat dete hain; the people of all faith go to visit Aulia Allah whereas the people of all faiths do not go to visit our MASJID. So there is a difference in the ways these Aulia Allah preach ISLAM.

With all these clarifications; I hope that we all should benefit from the discussions. If I missed anything please remind me so that I can clarify you on that aspect as well.

Wassalam,
Your brother in Islam


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mamqasmi on November 03, 2010, 03:10:52 PM
I agree to brother saying the word Sallaho Alayhi Wassalam instead of writing  (sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam).  But to make it a habit requires time. So if you read the word SAW in my discussion.. Just read it as Sallaho Alayhi Wassalam. The intention is to respect and love the prophet Sallaho Alayhi Wassalam to the extreme.

Brother aik cheez hoti hay kisi say Mohabbat karna aur doosri cheez hay us Mohabbat ka izhar karna – agar aap kisi say Mohabbat karain aur uskay izhaar main kotahi ya be adabi kar bethain to aisi mohabbat baaz auqaat zillat main tabdeel hojati hay – similarly Musalmaan niyyat k hawalay say to Huzoor Nabi e Kareem Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam say buhut Mohabbat kartay hain par baaz auqaat us mohabbat k izhaar main be adabi kar jatay hain – aur yeh bhe aik aisa he amal hay k bajaye iskay k hum yeh sochain k pura SALLALLAHO ALAIHAY WASALLAM likhnay main time lagayga aur short likhdain to kaam to ban jaega magar BE ADABI hojaegi jaisa k urdu main bhe pura likhnay k bajaye buhut say log sirf SUAAD likh daytay hain – is cheez par tamam Ulama e Haq ka ijmaa hay k aisa karna sahih nahen hay – beher haal yeh ishq o adab ki batain hain k jis Nabi ka aik aik pal apnay Ummati ki aaho baqa k liye guzra hum uskay liye thora sa time bhe na nikaal sakain



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mamqasmi on November 03, 2010, 03:40:07 PM
1.   KISI MEHBOOB YA PIYARI CHEEZ KO PANAY YA HASIL KARNAY SAY DIL KO JO LAZZAT HOTI HAY USKO FARAH KEHTAY HAIN AUR MEANINGS YEH HAIN K IMAAN WALON KO ALLAH K FAZL O REHMAT PAR KHUSH HONA CHAHIYE K USNAY UNHAIN MAWA’IZ AUR SHAFA SUDOOR AUR IMAAN K SAATH DIL KI RAHAT O SUKOON ATA FARMAYE

Reasoning: Do you believe that Prophets are beloved of Allah Subhana Wa taala. If they are not beloved;  they should not be prophets. If they are beloved then according to YOUR first Tafseer We feel happy and rejoice on the births of the Prophets; and we should celebrate their births; because they are “Mehboob”, Pyari Cheez, and we feel Farhat.. and that’s why Milaad Manaane se Dil ko farhat aur Sukoon Milta Hai.

Brother – hamain to bus Sarkar e Do Alam Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam ka milad manana chahiye but is say murad yeh nahen hay k doosray tamam ambiya Afzal nahen hay – beshak tamam ambia Afzal hain

Ab is baat ko aisay samajh lain k

Aik hain KHALEEL ALLAH  ya KHALEELULLAH yani Hazrat Ibrahim Alaihay Salaam jinko yeh rutba is liye mila k woh Allah Kareem ko dost maantay hain aur unko mehboob rakhtay thay

Magar uskay bar aks aik hain HABEEB ALLAH ya HABEEB ULLAH yani Sarkar e Do Alam Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam aur unko yeh rutba is liye mila k unko khud Allah Kareem apna mehboob manta hay

To is lehaaz say donon Allah Kareem k barguzeedah hastiyun main shamil hain magar aik woh hain jo Allah Kareem ko khud mehboob rakhtay hain aur doosray woh hain jinko Allah Kareem apna mehboob manta hay to hamain to is lehaz say intihayee khushi manani chahiye k hum gunahgaar unkay ummati hain jinko Allah Kareem khud mehboob rakhta hay aur Hazrat Isa Alaihay Salaam k ishq ko to dekhain k woh to khud is khuwahish main dunya say uthaliye gaye k jab dobarah wapas aayen to Huzoor Nabi e Kareem Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam k ummati ban k aayen

Aur aik baat aur batadon k Allah Kareem nay waqtan fawaqtan apnay Rasoolon pay Kitabain nazil farmayeen yani TORAIT, ZABOOR, INJEEL and finally QURAN E KAREEM magar yeh aap khud dekh lain k kis kitaab ki ziada afzaliyat hay – Dunya ki har kitaab ko talaash karna mushkil hay magar jab aap kisi ko bolain k Quran e Kareem lay aao to who foran lay aayega kyun k Dunya ki har kitab pay GHILAAF nahen hota


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mamqasmi on November 03, 2010, 03:58:05 PM
2.   Aur is ayat k mutaliq Hazrat Ibn e Abbas Razi Allaho Anho aur Hazrat Hasan Razi Allaho Anho aur Hazrat Qatadah Razi Allaho Anho nay farmaya hay k

ALLAH K FAZAL SAY ISLAM AUR USKI REHMAT SAY QURAN E PAK MURAD HAY

Reasoning: This is also Right. But my question is Can you get Qur’an without the beloved Prophet Muhammad Sallalo Alayhi Wassalam. You Should Say NO. There is no point of escape on this question. Similarly Can you get “Injeel”( Not the present Bible) without Prophet ISA(alayhis Salam). IF you can’t get Allah’s books without the Prophets; then How can you get Allah’s Happiness or Joy OR Farhat Without the Prophets. So you have to believe that the raising of the Prophets is the blessings of Allah Subhana Taala and we should celebrate their births.

Remind you that believing in ACTUAL injeel is a tenant of Faith. A momin has to believe in all four revelations of Allah Subhana wa Taala.

Brother mujhay yeh bataain k hum log yani Musalmaan bhe apni birthdays celebrate kartay hain jab yeh mamla Ulama e Haq say discuss huwa to unhon nay yeh fatwa diya k

Birthdays celebrate ki jasakteen hain k usmain koyee khurafaat – beja israaf aur ghair sharayee amal na ho (for example – music – drink – huge expenses – etc) –
Brother – simple isi tarah hum apnay ghar beth kar aur apnay logon yani Musalmanon k saath bhe unki birth day celebrate kar saktay hain, mahafil arrange kar saktay hain, Quran Khwani rakh saktay hain – then why we shud go especially to Church or any Non Muslim’s house to celebrate where the Music and drinks are going on very frequently……

Brother baat sirf itni hay k hum jaisay chotay log agar school ya college main Non Muslims k saath agar kuch share kar bhe lain to shayad koyee kuch na kahay magar koyee famous Aalim – Buzurg agar kisi ghair sharayee jaga pay jakay is tarah karain to buhut baatain banteen hain aura b to Media bhe itna fast hogaya hay k har cheez minutes main puri dunya main chali jaati hay to aisay waqt main to hamaray Ulama o Fuqaha ko buhut ahtiyaat say kaam layna chahiye yani TAQWA ikhtiyaar karna chahiye



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mamqasmi on November 03, 2010, 05:01:42 PM
3.   Aur aik aur qaul k mutabiq

FAZAL ALLAH SAY QURAN AUR REHMAT SAY AHADEES MARVI HAIN

Reasoning: I already explained about Qur’an. Again if you take AHadees as rehmat. My question is: Can you get any Ahadees without the Prophet? If No then you should accept that the all youre Tafseers leads to the meaning of Raising of the prophets. And the ummah should celebrate their births.

According to one of our sisters (on the forum) Raziya Warsi

I want to ask Hazrat Khwaja Garib Nawaaz  (Radiallahu Ta’ala Anhu). kabhi Koi XMAS party me gaye the..?
Kabhi kisi Hindu ki Diwaali me Gaye the..?

Kya Kabhi Alaa Hazrat  (Radiallahu Ta’ala Anhu)., Waris Paak  (Radiallahu Ta’ala Anhu)., Gaus Paak  (Radiallahu Ta’ala Anhu)., Makhdoom Sarkaar (Radiallahu Ta’ala Anhu)...Kya kabhi koi bhi Buzurgaane deen ne yeh tareeka apnaaya tha Dusre Musalmaanon ko Islam Qubool karwaane k liye...

Is sawaal ka kia jawaab hay aapkay paas ya yeh bataain k khud unkay Peer o Murshid nay kabhe aisa amal kia tha phir yeh kyun…………….


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mamqasmi on November 03, 2010, 05:04:09 PM
MERRY CHRISTMAS kehna shirk hay jis k lugwi maanay main yeh hay k Na’aa’ouzobillah Allah nay beta jana – to agar koyee celebration karnay main yeh kehday to Tajdeed e Islam aur Tajdeed Nikah karna parta hay yani aap Islam say kharij hosaktay hain

I want to know that Which Category of SHIRK does it fall into?  What is the main category of SHIRK and what is the Subcategory of SHIRK?  If you cannot give the reply on the category of Shirk then I think I should have to Start a topic on the "Definition and categorization of Tauheed and Shirk".

When we talk about Allah Kareem – no categories will be there – SHIRK is just SHIRK nothing else – in every sense

Brother Muslims agar Hazrat Isa Alaihay Salaam ki wildat celebrate karain to maqsad kuch aur hoga magar jab Non Muslim celebrate kartay hain to maqsad kuch aur hota hay woh basically unkay mazhab k hawalay say Maaz Allah - Allah Kareem k betay (son) ki wladat ki khushi main celebrate kartay hain to khud batao k kia unkay saath milkar celebrate karna ja'iz hay


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mamqasmi on November 03, 2010, 05:16:59 PM
Brother at last - I hope u don't mind because these are personal points aur main to Allah Kareem ka sab say gunahgaar o khatakaar banda hoon - is aajiz ki kia majaal k Buzurgan e Deen o Aulia Allah k saamnay lab kushayee kar sakay -

Any way - I think we don't wanna discuss more on some1's personal - but aik baat zaroor hay k ahtiyaat zaroori hay k fitna angeziyun say bacha jaye warna shayad ISLAM/ SUFISM/ IBADAAT main TAQWA ki istilah nahen hoti

The best things is to learn more from everywhere..........not to criticize everyone...............but war must alwayz there when Gustakh e Rasool Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam o Sahab e Kiram Ajmaeyeen o Aulia Allah o Buzurgan e Deen talk about our TRUE BELIEF

Allah Kareem say maafi ka khwastgaar hoon k agar is saray mamlay main na danista taur pay koyee Gustakhi o Be Adabi sar zad hogayee ho to ae Bari e Taala too tou be payan Rehmat wali zaat hay - apnay karam say maaf farma . Ameen
Kind regards,


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Nazneen on November 03, 2010, 07:12:21 PM
very well said Atif bhai....

Nice reply...

JAzk ALlahu khair.


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: ghaws786 on November 03, 2010, 09:50:25 PM
Reply for brother with ID MSMQasmi:

As-salamu-alaikum brothers and sisters

I would like to go directly to the topic. Brother (Atif Bhai if I am not wrong) has mentioned:

Brother – hamain to bus Sarkar e Do Alam Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam ka milad manana chahiye but is say murad yeh nahen hay k doosray tamam ambiya Afzal nahen hay – beshak tamam ambia Afzal hain

Reasoning: Brother what are you talking about? Allah (Subhana Wa Taala) has mentioned the births of MANY prophets in HIS own QURAN. For your reference.. pick up the Qur’an translation you believe in and look  for the following verses:

Birth of ISA (Alahissalam): Sura Al-I Imran; Verses 45-47
Birth/ Creation of ADAM (Alayhis salam) : Sura Baqarah ; Verses 30-34

I can quote you many prophets whose birth has been mentioned in Qur’an like Prophet Musa, Yahya, Adam, Isa, and beloved Prophet Muhammad Peace and Blessings on them all. I just want to save time for everyone reading these posts. All of us know this.. and nowhere does the Qur’an or any AHadis says that we should celebrate ONLY the birth of Prophet Muhammad Sallaho Alayhi Wassalam. We should be happy and celebrate the births of all beloved prophets.

You know, the actual problem is that we are not ready to accept ISA(aleyhis salam) as our prophet. We say it with the word of mouth but it did not show with our actions. We say it because believing in him is a part of Imaan. We treat him to be the prophet of Christans. Why don’t we all connect ISA Alehissalam with ISLAM. HE IS OUR PROPHET and he came to this world to preach ISLAM. He is not the property of any christen sect. If a group of people misunderstood his teachings then WHY SHOULD WE MUSLIMS CHANGE OUR BELIEF ON ISA(ALEYHISSALAM)

You also mentioned:

When we talk about Allah Kareem – no categories will be there – SHIRK is just SHIRK nothing else – in every sense

Actually this is no argument and is not acceptable. To declare anything to be shirk, it has to be placed into any category of Shirk. To help you, I would give you Three broad categories of Shirk and would like you to specify the subcategory. They are:

1.   Shirk Fil Ruboobiyat
2.   Shirk Fil- Uloohiyat
3.   Shirk Fil-Asmaa

And Trust me you cannot put his celebration on any catagories of shirk; because IT IS NOT SHIRK.

If you still cannot give the subcategory then accept that celebration of birth of ISA(Alahissalam) is not SHIRK in any sense; because it is mentioned by Qur’an and Allah Subhana wa Taala send Salaam on the day ISA Alahissalam was born and the day he will die being an ummati of Prophet Muhammad(sallao Alayhi Wassalam)

Rest whatever you wrote about in your arguments of defense on three tafseers and my replies does not Prove anything.

Yes of course I would take the question of sister in my next post and I have the reply for her also.


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: ghaws786 on November 03, 2010, 10:10:45 PM
Reply for Brother with ID: Soldier of Islam

Brother you mentioned that:

What i think is what you are trying to do is Justify wrong actions of somebody by manipulating the Meaning of Verses of Quran according to your own needs.

Reasoning: Brother What benefit should I get to justify one’s wrong actions. I also have to die one day and face Allah and his beloved Prophet Muhammad (sallalo Alayhi Wassalam). What answer should I give to them if I support someone’s wrong actions? You prove me wrong with your arguments I will accept your point of view. If you cannot prove that accept that this is the Truth and leave your point of view. Whatever you believe DOES NOT ACTUALLY CHANGE THE LAW OF SHARIA IN ANY SENSE.

You also mentioned that:

Also why you choose 25 Dec for it Only bcoz Non Muslims are doing it and you will get a bigger Audience..?

Reasoning: Do you really think that he needs a bigger audience. Do you know that he holds the biggest Eitkaaf all over the World in the premises of Minhaj ul Qur'an every year after Harmain-sahrifain. Do you know that he holds the biggest gathering of Milad un Nabi(Sallalo Alayhi Wassaalam) every year at Minar-e Pakistan? Do you still think that he needs bigger audience? Be honest to yourself.

The actual point which we are missing here is what I mentioned in my last post that we are not ready to accept ISA (Aleyhissalam) as OUR Prophet. WE do no believe that he came to this world to preach ISLAM. If a sect of christens misunderstood him.. ARE WE MUSLIMS REPONSIBLE FOR THIS. We should not change our belief just for some sect of people.
The only thing which is left now is the question which our sister raised..and I think everyone is concentrated on that reply.

Wait for my next post for a reply on her question. Believe me, I have the answer, I am just holding it up to satisfy everyone else before I start answering that question.. which I will do at the right moment Insha Allah.

I would love to hear any other comments or arguments on my post; if there are any.

Wassalam,
Your brother in Islam


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Soldier of Islam on November 04, 2010, 02:11:01 PM
Brother ghaws786 you are just trying to decide for us all the wrong things....

NO MUSLIM CAN BE A MUSLIM if he DOES not believe in ISA  (Alaihis Salaam)  or for that matter any other prophet of ISLAM.
EACH and EVERY muslim on the face of EARTH (from whichever sect he may be) believes and
Prophet ISA  Alaihis Salaam . is a Prophet and One of the Mightiest Prophet of ALLAH (Subhana wa taaala).

We Ahle Sunnah wal jamaat have immense respect for Each and every prophet of ISLAM.whether mentioned in Quran or not..
Even the 124000 mentioned by our AAQA  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam we have immense respect for them also..

But when you have been Given the BEST OF ALL THE PROPHETS..
THE LEADER OF THE PROPHETS to follow why are you leaving his SUNNAH and Following other prophets.
You are an UMMATI of AAQA  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam and till now you have not fulfilled his Sunnah 100% and you want to
please your Christian friends and follow their footsteps.

This is Absolutely not an Action of a TRUE SUNNI Scholar..

With Immense Respect and Honor to Hazrat Isa  Alaihis Salaam . I am again telling you..
You are forgetting that you are in Ummat of PROPHET MUHAMMED  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam and not ISA  Alaihis Salaam .


Loving and Respecting ISA  Alaihis Salaam. does not mean that you go to Churches or Attend Christmas parties ..
Looking at this the Innocent Ummah will be Mislead and thats what happening.....

He is just trying to mislead the Ummah into things which will lead them to MUCH GREATER SINS.

You have not even convinced me 0.1% that what Your Said Scholar is doing by attending NON MUSLIMS functions
is Good for the Ummah at all.

And ALSO I agree you will NEVER EVER GIVE UP in your Life justifying his Actions..
becoz i am assuming that he may Be Your PEER SAHAB ..And no Mureed would like to hear anything
against his Peer and thats correct also.

But we have to say the Truth and take side with HAQ and the
Truth remains that SOME of his Actions are against the Teachings of ISLAM and SUNNAH.. Thats all.

My answer remains the same
http://kgn786.com/forum/index.php/topic,19335.msg67281.html#msg67281 (http://kgn786.com/forum/index.php/topic,19335.msg67281.html#msg67281)


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: arsh1226 on November 04, 2010, 03:21:56 PM
No Amount of Justification can justify this Act of Celebrating Christmas with Non Muslims.
In my personal opinion this Demands and Apology and a clarification for the Said Scholar.

DEAR SOLDIER OF ISLAM

I THOUGHT THIS WAS THE PLACE OF STUDENTS , I WAS WRONG ,,,,, THIS PLACE HAS TEACHERS  DEN ,,,,
ALLAH ALLAH  KARKAY DO BOOK PADLIYE  AUR CHALAY HI KAY ALIMOAN KAY BARABAR KARNAY
..........................

I AM ONLY FINDING CRTICISM IN THIS FORUM THAN UNDERSTANDING AND RESPECT(SPEACAILLY WHEN IT COMES TO ALIMS,,,,

SAB HUQ PAY H-------------- PHIR KAUAN BEHAQ PAY???????????????????????????

BAAD AKEEDA LOAGOAN THO HAMARAY PUR HASANGHAY ,,,,,,,,,,,,,


DONT FEEL LIKE CONTINUING  IN THIS  FORUM...................

IT DOES NOT MAKE DIFFERENCE TO ANYONE, BUT THE TRUTH IS WE HAVE BECOME BAYADAB



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: masood on November 04, 2010, 03:56:17 PM
Dear Brother Arsh1226,
Every person on a Forum has got a right to voice his opinion in the most Democratic way maintaining the Decorum of the Forum.
if you do not agree with somebody's views you are free to post your views but we cannot get into somebody's mind and change his way of thinking.

When you talk of Bayadabi i will give you a reference of one post which is there on
ONE OF THE BIGGEST Sunni Forum of the world Without taking its name
 and has been posted by a TEAM member on the subject of Ecstasy and Mehfil e Sama.

Quote
The responses to the thread have amused me more than the video itself.
Seriously, how naive can you get! Some guy even set out to do "research".
Well whatever tickles you fancy I guess, but as far as I'm concerned, its a gathering of clowns whose beards weigh more than their brains.
But great comic value - its a maulvi circus! - I'd be willing to spare 2 quid to go watch that freak show live.

I guess this is what we should  call Beadbi.

I guess you are new to the Forum Culture, and have not visited other Forums to see a discussion goes into Hundreds of replies and everyone is given a fair chance to speak, My advice to you would be you are free to visit any forum and join any forum and also free to leave your comments on any post and so is everybody else.

Here brother ghaws786 is handling the matter very carefully and has given some very interesting replies on the matter.



Hazrat Sayyiduna Abdullah Bin Umro Farmata Hain Ka Ak shask Ne Mustafa Kareem   (Salallaho Alehi Wassalam)
Se Arz Kia ," Muja asa amal Bataiya Jo muja Jannat Mein Dakhil Kar De, To  Aap  (Salallaho Alehi Wassalam) Ne Farmaya  
" Gussa Mat Kia Karo Thumha Jannat Hasil Ho Jaya Gi"

Al najamul al wasat Bab alif ,R, 2353,jild 2 , Page 20



If you feel that a particular topic is hurting your sentiments and should be locked you are free to REPORT IT TO THE MODERATORS
and if Many people report the same topic it will be considered to be locked or Removed from the
Forum as decided by the Forum MANAGEMENT.


Best Regards

Admin


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: ghaws786 on November 04, 2010, 07:46:37 PM
Reply for Sister Razia Warsi:

As-salamu-alaikum sister and everyone reading this post. I think this is the right time to reply to your very interesting question

Coming directly to the question which sister asked me.

I want to ask Hazrat Khwaja Garib Nawaaz  (Radiallahu Ta’ala Anhu). kabhi Koi XMAS party me gaye the..?Kabhi kisi Hindu ki Diwaali me Gaye the..?

Let me start from the incidents of the time of Prophet Muhammad (sallaho alahi wassalam) because his action becomes Sunnah for the ummah. If I prove the action of any Aulia-Allah then their actions does not become Sunnah for the Ummah. However  Aulia Allah also follow the Sunnah of Prophet Muhammad (sallaho Alayhi Wassalam)

Secondly, let me start from Qur’an itself because everyone should believe in Qur’an –e Pak instead of any other book.

Incident 1. : Qur’an mentioned the incident of change of Qibla in great detail. I do not have to give references and quotations for that. We all know that before and during the times of Prophet Muhammad (sallaho Alahi wassalam) Kaaba was in control of Arab Pegans which are a mix of  jews and christens of  Makkah and they used to pray at Kaaba in their ways.
At that time and before the incident of Tahveel-e Qibla, Muslims pray facing Baitul-Maqdis; until Prophet Muhammad(sallaho alayhi Wassalam) changed the direction and commanded his ummah to face towards Kaaba tullah and pray as we pray.

Reasoning: Did prophet Muhammad (sallaho Ayahi Wassalam) not know that jews and Christians were praying facing Kaaba since ages? (Relation:Do we Muslims not know in the present times that christens celebrate the birth of OUR prophet?)

 If Prophet Muhammad (sallao alayhi wassalam) knows that jews and christans were praying facing kaaba since ages; DID HE CHANGED THE COMMANDMENT OF ALLAH because a section of human beings were doing the same act? THE ANSWER IS BIG NOOOO. He asked his ummah to still face towards Kaaba and pray; knowing very well that there were many idols placed inside the Kaaba.(Remember that idols were removed on Fateh  Makkah). He changed the direction towards Kaabatullah (as they were facing) but KEPT THE METHOD OF WORSHIP SAME AS MUSLIMS. This is what I want to highlight; that we should also keep the celebration of Milad of ISA (Alayhissalam) and change the ways and start doing OUR ACTS OF FASTING AND ALLAH’s WORSHIP as we do on Milad un Nabi(Sallaho Alayhi Wasallam).

So now tell me; which action is more dangerous and close to shirk..? CHANGING the direction of Kaaba? Or Celebrating the birth of Prophet ISA(Alahis salam)? I leave it upto you to decide.

INCIDENT 2: We all know that Ashura is celebrated on 10th of Muharram since ages even before the times of Prophet Muhammad(sallaho Alayhi Wasallam) by jews and christens, because this day has high significance in relation to many Prophets. Jews used to keep fast on this day. Prophet Muhammad (sallaho alayhi wassalam) knowing that this day is being observed by jews; he asked his ummah to keep fast ON THE SAME DAY. Later on the incident of Karbala took place on the same day and this day is related to Muslims more than jews.

Reasoning: Why did  prophet Muhammad(sallaho Alayhi Wassalam) did not changed the day. If he wants he could change it to any other day; but because this day is related to incidents of many prophets he never did that and asked his ummah to keep fast on the same day 10th of Muharram. Here also he did not change the law of shariah in any sense based on the practice of some sect of people like jews or christens.

This is what I am trying to explain in these posts that the actions of jews or christens do not actually change the LAW OF SHARIA and commandment of Allah for we Muslims in any sense.

Now coming back to the question of sister: She asked whether any Aulia- Allah went to any of these functions? Then Why Now..?

So sister, this scholar (Dr. Muhammad Tahir ul Qadri) also NEVER WENT to this function. Just look at the picture and video again and you can very well identify that this celebration is being held in the premises of Minhaj ul Qur’an. He has never gone to any church or any party and celebrated with them.

He is just holding the Milad of second Mightiest Messanger of Allah Subhana wa taala in HIS WAYS at HIS PREMESIS. He is not doing any haraam act or any act of drinking or parting with music etc. or what christens does.

He is just trying to give a message to ummat-e Muslima to hold the milad of OUR PROPHET in OUR WAYS. And I think this is totally permissible.

At last.. I would like to mention some facts about me.. Because I think that some of my brothers and sisters might start misunderstanding my Aqeeda also; after reading my posts and my point of view.

Brothers, I am a born Indian, at present in Canada, and a Sunni Muslim. I belong to Hanafi madhab and I am not in Bayt with Dr. Muhammad tahir ul Qadri. He does not take any Bayt at all. Yes, Of course, I listen to him and he is one of my teachers. I am also a student of Shah Ahmed Raza Khan Barelvi (Rehma tulla-e Tallah Alay). Most of you should not know this that Dr. Muhammad Tahir ul Qadri is also a grand student of Shah Ahmed Raza Khan Barelvi (Rehma tulla-e Tallah Alay), with only one teacher between him and Ala Hazrat((Rehma tulla-e Tallah Alay).  I belong to Silsila Qadria and Mureed of Ghaus-e Pak Shaikh Abdul Qadir Al-Gilani(Rehma tulla-e Tallah Alay). I think this should be enough about me for everyone to believe that I am a sunni Muslim.

At last I would like to thank brother Masood Khatri for the comments he made about me in his post.

Thanks for your comments and considerations. I look forward to any comments and compliments.

Wassalam,
Your brother in ISLAM


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: huma on November 04, 2010, 08:25:17 PM
I am glad brother Imran thought about niyat.. which is the fundamental to Islam.. if we celebrate with guilt , it is gunnah, if we celebrate because u will make some one happy, a someone who si truly sincere but majboor, then there is no question of a sin..., well such conditional polls can bring conflict.no?


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: benazir on November 05, 2010, 09:16:32 AM
assalaam alaikum wa rahmatullaahi wa barakatuh. i believe wish non muslimsand dont get involved in thier festivals. secondly someone criticised dr.tahir ul qadri. i feel we are no one to criticise anybody as we are normal muslims. hum khud apne eimaan k e kachche hain hum kisiko kya bura bhala kahe. QURAAN-E-PAAK AUR HADEES ko follow karo. apni namaz ko waqt pe pado. baakhi sahi bura bolne ka decision ulema aur aalimo aur renowned scholars pe rehne do.  my veiw is wish them and do not get involved in their festivals. agar hum pehle hi inko door karenge toh islaam ki dawat kaise denge. baaki ALLAAH SUBHAAN WA TA'AALA zyada behtar jaante hain


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Rizwan Maniar on November 05, 2010, 11:39:53 AM
$ Arsh

U said ''People who consider shakul islam Dr.Tahirul Qadri(saheb)  as''GUMRAH'' are themselves .''GUMRAH'',,,

as far as the Hujjat ul islam ,stop it brother , its yours words or someonelse but its sound arrogant.

 Before posting any comments on shakyul islam Dr.Tahirul Qadri(saheb) make sure you understand what message he delivers and how qualified he is.
''

OK lets carry o here, kindly explain can a muslim attend funeral prayers of a gustakh e Rasool sallallahu alaihi wasallamn, is this the aqaid of ahle sunnah brother, kindly reply ???, terming all sunnat as gumrah will not be tolerated in this forum , nrxt time b careful brother , ur lines r deleted


waiting 4 the answer


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: ghaws786 on November 05, 2010, 02:46:41 PM
As-salamu-alaikum All,

I think the poll question is wrong and posted in a tricky way. The question says:

Is it gunah to celebrate chrismas with Non-Muslims? whereas It should be posted as:

IS IT GUNAH TO CELEBRATE CHRISTMAS IN ISLAM?
OR IS IT GUNAH TO WISH NON_MUSLIM ON HIS FESTIVAL?

And I think this is what the discussion is all about. I would love to hear from other members..

Wassalam
Your brother in ISLAM.


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: DesignJinni on November 05, 2010, 02:56:51 PM
Assalam-o-Alaikum !!! Wa Rehmatullahi Wa Barakatuhu Wa Maghfiratuhu,
Quote
mamqasmi wrote:
aisa k MERRY CHRISTMAS kehna shirk hay jis k lugwi maanay main yeh hay k Na’aa’ouzobillah Allah nay beta jana – to agar koyee celebration karnay main yeh kehday to Tajdeed e Islam aur Tajdeed Nikah karna parta hay yani aap Islam say kharij hosaktay hain

Brother, where do you get your definitions from? Shirk tu loog asie use karte hai jese koi AK47 ho and shirk ki bullets fire karte jayo... and ye bi shirk wo bi shirk, har cheez shirk... I don't feel that to be appropiate. We should be very carefull in this.
Etymology (Christmass)
The word Christmas originated as a compound meaning "Christ's Mass".
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas)

Christ: means Messiah (the anointed one) yanni Hazrat Isa Alaihay Salaam
Mass (liturgy): means Festival
& I think we all know what "Merry" means.

Plus so many christans religiously do not believe that Jesus is the son of God, but they have merry christmass as well....

So, I don't know how you derive the definition of "Allah ne bacha jana"? (Naauzuillah) -- from the word merry Christmass.


Quote
Rizwan Maniar wrote:
Infact a large no. of ulema has termed Tahirul Qadri as ''GUMRAH''

Rizwan bhai, leave the large no of Ulema and please list the top 10 Ulema's name and to which jammat they belong to i.e Debandis, Salafi etc and I mean the top 10 not the bottom 10 ulemas you find so authentic to label him as Gumrah!

When you list the names of those ulemas then a lot of things will get clear that why do they label him as Gumrah :)


@ Admin
I think yo also need to add another selection in the vote option as
- Yes
- No
- I don't know

Becasue I think i have not yet reached any hard conclusion on this yet, but would love to see Tahir ul Qadri explain on this subject, as he has so much knowledge and he sure can explain it in the light of science. Tahir ul Qadri was was not doing a a merry christmas party it was an Interfaith dailouge event held on that day to invite Christans to islam to tell them how much we love Isa and to shed lights on the event and on Islamic teachings.

Cheers & Peace


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: DesignJinni on November 05, 2010, 03:02:22 PM
Correction: but would love to see Tahir ul Qadri explain on this subject, as he has so much knowledge and he sure can explain it in the light of Quran & Hadith

@Admin,  
I dont see any option on how to edit my post like I used to see before... where is it gone?


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Soldier of Islam on November 05, 2010, 03:07:09 PM
IS IT GUNAH TO CELEBRATE CHRISTMAS IN ISLAM?
Is it Gunaah to celebrate Christmas with Non Muslims.?
Both have the same meaning... One Sentence can be written in many ways....

Dear brother ghaws786 all your replies did not convince me
my answer remains the same
http://kgn786.com/forum/index.php/topic,19335.msg67634.html#msg67634 (http://kgn786.com/forum/index.php/topic,19335.msg67634.html#msg67634)

I would love to hear the reply for Rizwan bhai's last Question...




Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: ghaws786 on November 05, 2010, 03:37:43 PM
Reply for brother with ID: Soldier of Islam:

No brother statements DO NOT HAVE THE SAME MEANING

IS IT GUNAH TO CELEBRATE CHRISTMAS WITH NON_MUSLIMS: means that a MUSLIMS WENT TO THEIR PLACE to celebrate christmas with them. Whereas

IS IT GUNAH TO CELEBRATE CHRISTMAS IN ISLAM MEANS: IS it Allowed or NOT Allowed TO Celebrate MILAD OF ISA( Alayhis Salam) in ISLAM? Both Statements are different. One should be careful of the meaning. That's why I said; It's a tricky question.

Regarding your position on my arguments: Look brother, You are my brother in ISLAM. I can give you my point of view and can prove my statements whatever I wrote. I cannot enter in your mind and change your point of view. And it is on Allah(subhana Wa Taala) to give Hidayat to anyone. Who am I...NOTHING. I am still in my learning phase. I always pray to Allahpak to bless me with the power of knowledge to save me and my family; which is needed in the present difficult time of distress for Mulim Ummah.

If you are not convinced with my arguments and discussion.. then you are not at fault in any sense. I can only make dua for you. May Allahpak open up our hearts and shower HIS special blessings on all of us.

Wassalam,
Your brother in ISLAM


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mamqasmi on November 05, 2010, 03:58:12 PM
Assalam-o-Alaikum !!! Wa Rehmatullahi Wa Barakatuhu Wa Maghfiratuhu,
Brother, where do you get your definitions from? Shirk tu loog asie use karte hai jese koi AK47 ho and shirk ki bullets fire karte jayo... and ye bi shirk wo bi shirk, har cheez shirk... I don't feel that to be appropiate. We should be very carefull in this.
Etymology (Christmass)
The word Christmas originated as a compound meaning "Christ's Mass".
Source: [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas[/url] ([url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas[/url])
Christ: means Messiah (the anointed one) yanni Hazrat Isa Alaihay Salaam
Mass (liturgy): means Festival
& I think we all know what "Merry" means.

Plus so many christans religiously do not believe that Jesus is the son of God, but they have merry christmass as well....

So, I don't know how you derive the definition of "Allah ne bacha jana"? (Naauzuillah) -- from the word merry Christmass.

@ Admin
I think yo also need to add another selection in the vote option as
- Yes
- No
- I don't know
Becasue I think i have not yet reached any hard conclusion on this yet, but would love to see Tahir ul Qadri explain on this subject, as he has so much knowledge and he sure can explain it in the light of science. Tahir ul Qadri was was not doing a a merry christmas party it was an Interfaith dailouge event held on that day to invite Christans to islam to tell them how much we love Isa and to shed lights on the event and on Islamic teachings.

Cheers & Peace


Sister - Jazak Allah for ur comments

But please note k mainay LUGHWI MEANINGS likhay hain not EXACTLY MEANINGS of Merry Chirstmas likhay hain aur khud say nahen likhay hain kyun ka is naqis ul aql insaan main itni taqat nahen k aisa likh sakon balkay woh likha hay jo Ulama e Ahle Sunnat say suna hay is baray main.

Chunkay Islam main TAQWA (yani AHTIYAAT) ki bunyaad bhe maujood hay is liye baaz auqaat fitna angaizi phel jaati hay is liye khas tour pay Ulam e Haq ko is tarah ki sargarmiyun say bachna chahiye.

Ab yeh note  karlain k Ulama e Haq nay kyun is cheez say bachnay ka kaha hay
Chunkay CHRISTMAS ka Quran o Sunnat main hamain koyee suboot nahen milta aur na kabhe Huzoor Nabi e Kareem Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam k daur say aaj tak kisi Muslim nay isko celebrate kia hay - Baat sirf itni hay sab jaantay hain k Allah Kareem nay hum Musalmanon ko kyun mana farmaya hay k YAHOOD O NASARA KO DOST NA BANAO (ya woh tumharay dost nahen hain) shayad yehi waja hay k unkay mamlaat Islam k mutabiq nahen hain unka aqida alag hay

Wikipedia pay bhe yehi likha hay k
Christmasor Christmas Day is a holiday observed mostly on December 25 to commemorate the birth of Jesus
That means k woh Hazrat Isa Alaihay Salaam ki wiladat ko ba qaida celebrate kar rahay hain apnay aqiday k mutabiq (HUM BHE CELEBRATE KAR SAKTAY HAIN JAISA K MAINAY PEHLAY BAYAN KIA HAY K WOH KAISAY...) aur unka aqida chunkay yeh hay k woh Hazrat Isa Alaihay Salaam ko Allah Kareem ka beta (SON) maantay hain (Na'aouzobillah) aur shayad no one is refused this fact. Hikmat unkay haan yeh hay k chunkay aapki wiladat bin baap k huwe thee

Yeh TAQWA hamesha say Buzurgan e Deen o Aulia Allah ka khaasa raha hay unki riazat o ibadat ka main markaz lehaza hamain bhe yehi chahiye k bachain jahan tak hosakay kisi fitna angaizi k honay say

And at last about Dr. Sahab - I am personally big follower of his Islamic information and lectures and I have too many books of him at home - plz read my personal views
http://kgn786.com/forum/index.php/topic,19716.msg67814.html#msg67814 (http://kgn786.com/forum/index.php/topic,19716.msg67814.html#msg67814)



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Rehana Raza Khan on November 05, 2010, 06:08:25 PM
This is ridiculous- I DO NOT AGREE that Muslims can celebrate Christams at all.
Yes they can celebrate the Birth of Isa  Alaihis Salaam . or for that matter any prophet of Islam

But according to my knowledge Inviting or Visiting Christians and Inviting Media
and News does not have any room in ISLAM.


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: DesignJinni on November 05, 2010, 06:09:58 PM
mamqasmi, I think you missed the whole point, I am not arguing if cleberating christmans is jayez or not, My argument was: Merry Christmass does not mean "Allah ne bacha jana"? (Naauzuillah) like you said in your post, and also I said not all the christans believe Jesus to be the son of God, and I know many christans who do not believe in such an idea. Hence you cannot paint all using the same brush. Mostly salfi ulemas try to impose this idea which every one know that is not right.

Its like, Christan ask you do you believe in Jesus, You will say yes, that will not mean that you believe of his whole idea of Jesus and what not and saying and agreing to a christan that yes i believe in Jesus will not be shirk either.

Regards,
Your Brother in Islam.


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Kabir Das on November 05, 2010, 06:15:15 PM
I dont know much about Islam but i guess wishing someone just for the sake of maintaining cordial relationship should not be a problem but what i want to know will it be OK if you invite non muslims to your home and actually celebrate Christmas there way.

can somebody please give me a list of other Islamic scholars who have done this?
or is it Dr. Tahir Sahab alone fighting this battle?


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: ghaws786 on November 05, 2010, 07:14:14 PM
Reply for Brother Kabir Das:

As-salamu-alaikum all,

Brother I have already answered your question in one of my previous posts. You may invite any non-muslim to your home on christmas or (Milad of Isa alahissalam) but whatever acts you do in the celebration should be in consonance with Islamic Law and Sharia. Since it is your home and they are a guests at your home; they would not do any act of their own and without your permission. Now it's up to you to decide which way you want to celebrate this event.

Regarding the list of scholars: As per my information; It's only Dr. Muhammad Tahir ul qadri Sb. who is fighting the battle and getting fruitful results for his Mission Minhaj ul Qur'an.

Wassalam,
Your Brother in Islam


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Kabir Das on November 06, 2010, 12:18:02 AM
Walikum Assalaam Wa Rehamtullahe Wa Barkathu.,
Brother this means that all other Islamic Scholars are wrong in NOT CELEBRATING Chirstmas and only Dr Tahir ul qadri sahab is Correct in CELEBRATING Christmas.

Secondly if my children call their Non Muslims Friends for celebrating Christmas
Do you think that his Non Muslim Friends will not call him again at his home to celebrate Christmas to pay back the favour.

And in such case if my Child drinks wine or eats pork then who will be responsible?
Will Dr Sahib take this responsibility..?

Wsslam,
Not a Muslim Yet but Trying to understand your religion.
Your Brother in HUMANITY.


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Raziya Warsi on November 06, 2010, 12:24:41 AM
yeh hokya gya hai muslamaanon ko Kisi ko mangalsutra pehnna hai kisi ko christmas banaana hai ...
apne din ko abhi tak samjhe nai hai aur dusron k deen ko apnaane chale hain..

kya koi ek nya firka bnaa rahe hain aaj k yeh naye ulema?

Celebrating Non Muslim festival whether at their home or in your home is STRICTLY prohibited in ISLAM.


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Shifa Chishty on November 06, 2010, 12:51:39 AM
after reading so many post on this topic.
I have realised that the whole focus has been shifted.

What i understand is that Wishing a Non Muslim is different thing and celebrating it with non muslims is a seperate thing..

The orignal question which started this discussion was Is wishing allowed.
So my answer would be Yes it is Allowed.

But If you ask me is Celebrating with them is allowed.
My Answer would be NO its not allowed.
If you want to celebrate the Birth of Hazrat Isa.  (Alaihis Salaam)  then calmly Do Khatmul Quran, Fast Pray and offer Salah.
No need to call these Naapaak people at your home...

I want to know is their any SILSILA like QADRIA, CHISHTIA, MADAARI, REHMAANI, SULTAANI
any silsila anywhere in the world which is celebrating Christmas or Birth of ISA  Alaihis Salaam .



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: huma on November 06, 2010, 06:56:48 AM
Well, I am sure most of these replies are fro men well within their '30s and for Allah's sake show more courage and heart in such matters. Let us remind ourselves that we live in a world ruled by technology without which this discussion may not be possible. This technology and its development has been a necessity for the West in the place of faith. I am sure  u will not deny that  some of them are also  moslems ( insha allah) in the making. Are we not part of this technology world, is that a gunah or crime to work in a place of non-moslems?
When we work and share time with non-moslems how much time has gone in directly or indirectly conveying the message of the prophet ?, Professionalism in any corporate unit does not alllow such practices. Can we then as moslems choose to isolate ourselves form the rest of the society because they do everything we do not like.
Mohabbat se kaam nipatna hoga... mera bolne ka matlab, every adult u see at work is not an adult in religion. He/she is not mature to understand the pure essence of the Prophets ( sallalaho alaihe wa sallam). Our reason to reject their religion is jayaz and justified by our faith in Islam, but if we are serious about making  islam understandable to a non-moslem who is ur friend, you cannot reject his moments of happiness while accepting his other moments. It is nowhere human. Insaaniyat se, agar kaam karna , then we have act with pure afffection and fath.
It is not necessary that I must adopt one single method of action for everyone.., if I am a true moslem and since it is a sufi forum, I have to add also a sufi, u have to try different medicines/ cures for different persons. We must have the capacity to develop that intelligence to know who amongst the non-moslems are true idol worshippers and who are not and accordingly choose to participate or not participate. Only if u are there with them can something happen to them, if the moslems leave them as friends, then what is the future of these non-moslems, and what answer will u give Allah subhanu ta'ala on the day of judgement ?" I was too busy thinking what was right and wrong about wishing or not-wishing Eid-mubarak to non-moslems'"?  A true moslem is like a doctor who has faith in his practice above other things and not like a politician who understands no faith except in opportunity..
Please accept my apologies if I have said anything that hurt anyone's sentiments.. that was not my intention.


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mushfique on November 06, 2010, 09:03:19 AM
after reading so many post on this topic.
I have realised that the whole focus has been shifted.

What i understand is that Wishing a Non Muslim is different thing and celebrating it with non muslims is a seperate thing..

The orignal question which started this discussion was Is wishing allowed.
So my answer would be Yes it is Allowed.

But If you ask me is Celebrating with them is allowed.
My Answer would be NO its not allowed.
If you want to celebrate the Birth of Hazrat Isa.  (Alaihis Salaam)  then calmly Do Khatmul Quran, Fast Pray and offer Salah.
No need to call these Naapaak people at your home...

I want to know is their any SILSILA like QADRIA, CHISHTIA, MADAARI, REHMAANI, SULTAANI
any silsila anywhere in the world which is celebrating Christmas or Birth of ISA  Alaihis Salaam .




Sister Shifa,
Very well said that the two topics are different. No muslim will ever say that we have to celebrate the non muslim’s festival or he is celebrating it.

There are many non mulsims who visits the Darghas on these special occasions of theirs and they ask for their needs at the darghas. Do we also mean to say that the Buzurgs must also ignore them and say that it is their day so why to pray for them on this special occasion? They are wrong etc etc….

I see many people asking here questions like “Did Khwaja Saheb ever celebrated this and that” I ask you to see and check how non muslims believe in Ajmer sharif and how they visit Ajmer sharif and ask for their needs on their festivals and they get fulfilled.

If blessing someone on the day his festival is been celebrated, is wrong then all the gates of Darghas of Auliya Allah must be closed on these days.

We muslims must abstain from calling or labelling our brother muslims as Sinner, Kaafir or mushrik as Allah knows better everyone’s intention and he will judge everyone according to their intention.

Wais eek Fatwa share karna chahta hun Darul Ifta Ahle Sunnat Karachi ka jismein Mufti saheb ne Kaha hai ke non muslim ko rasmi talukat ke binah per mubarakbaad dena gunah hai kufr nahi aur agar kaafiron ke kisi din ko baa azmat jaanke uski Mubarak baadi detahai to aisa shaks kaafir hai.

Mushfique




Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: mushfique on November 06, 2010, 09:12:12 AM
Admin se Guzarish hai ke unhone jo polling rakha hai usmein topic galat likha hai.
Admin ne likha hai topic :   Is it Gunaah to celebrate Christmas with Non Muslims.?
Jubke asli topic hai:            Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?

Ye agar janbujhke kiya jaa raha hai to fir no excuse aur agar galti se to admin ne kuch karna chahiye.
Mushfique


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: ghaws786 on November 06, 2010, 09:41:41 AM
Reply for Brother Kabir Das:

As-salamu-alaikum brother and everyone reading this post.

First of all, I would like to congratulate you for your research on Islam. Secondly, you raised two very important issues.

1. You mentioned that "this means that other Islamic scholars are wrong in NOT CELEBRATING christmas and only Dr. Tahir ul Qadri Sb. is correct in Celebrating Christmas?"

Reasoning: I would say other scholars do not commit any sin by NOT CELEBRATING Christmas; but Dr. Muhammad Tahir ul Qadri is correct in his action.

Dr. Tahir ul Qadri based his action on Qur'an, hadees and Sunnah of Prophet Muhammad (Sallaho Alayhi Wassalam). If any scholar wants to Issue Fatwa against his action. MOST WELCOME. He should be prepared to PROVE IT.

In my previous posts, I left no stone untouched to Prove my point of view from Qur'an, AHadees and Sunnah of our beloved prophet Muhammad(Sallao Alayhi Wassalam).

With due respect for everyone, I would say,NO-ONE in this whole forum was able to justify their point of view from Qur'an, Ahadees and Sunnah of Prophet Muhammad(sallaho Alayhi Wassalam).. Most of them just say it's SHIRK. They are not able to justify WHY IT IS SHIRK? Which category of Shirk is it and Why is it unacceptable? There should be a reasoning for every action in ISLAM and every action is based on the law of Sharia.

I am still open for discussion on anything which I mentioned in any of my post. If you Prove this act Wrong through Qur'an Ahadees and Sunnah of Prophet Muhammad (Sallao Alayhi Wassalam); then Believe me I would change my point of view also.

Why other scholars do not celebrate--May be they cannot justify their action through Qur'an or Sunnah. And that's why they are scared to do it. This can be one of the reasons.

Secondly you asked me:

Do you think that your child's Non Muslim Friends will not call him again at his home to celebrate Christmas to pay back the favor.

And in such case if my Child drinks wine or eats pork then who will be responsible?
Will Dr Sahib take this responsibility..?

Reasoning: Brother Can your child drinks wine or eat pork ONLY at Christmas party? Don't YOU THINK He can do this action with his friends on ANY OTHER DAY OF THE YEAR say NEW YEAR PARTY? What Fatwa Will you give then.. and WHO IS RESPONSIBLE THEN? Will you go and guard your child everywhere he or she go and Whatever he or she does in the whole year?

I don't understand WHY everyone wants to discuss ONLY BAD actions with Christmas? If your child Does ZIkr, Azkar, Salatul- Tasbeeh, or Tahajjud at night; will you hold DR. Sb. Responsible for that? I think NOT AT ALL. You would definitely feel proud that you taught your child the right things.. and that's why he is doing these activities.

So, if you Take the responsibility of his Good Actions.. why are you not ready to take responsibility of his bad actions? Why don't you teach him which act is good/ Which is Bad? Please Stop blaming others for your actions; or your child's actions. Your child is not brought up at Dr. sb. home. You are responsible to inculcate good values in your child. And this is the responsibility of the parents to teach what is good/ What is bad? Who to make friend/ Who not? What to do and What not to do?

So just think for a while.. If we start conducting the celebrations of Milad of Isa( Alayhis Salam) in our ways as we do hold the festivities of Milad of Prophet Muhammad(Sallaho Alayhi Wassalam) then with the passage of time, there will be no Christmas at all for christens; it will only be Milad of our second Mightest Messanger of Islam. We will not be terrified of drinking or parties on this festival and we will be able to justify to our childern also. Everything will be streamlined as per Qur'an Hadees and Sunnah of Prophet Muhammad( Sallaho Alayhi Wassalam)

Wassalam,
Your brother in Islam


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: ghaws786 on November 06, 2010, 10:05:22 AM
Question for Brother with ID msmqasmi:

As-salamu-alaikum all,

Brother you mentioned that:

But please note k mainay LUGHWI MEANINGS likhay hain not EXACTLY MEANINGS of Merry Chirstmas likhay hain aur khud say nahen likhay hain

I want to know the reference of the book of Lughad from which you get this meaning? Please quote. I need to verify.

Wassalam,
Your brother in Islam


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Shifa Chishty on November 06, 2010, 10:55:36 AM
At last one sensible men on the forum (mushfique)

Quote

Wais eek Fatwa share karna chahta hun Darul Ifta Ahle Sunnat Karachi ka jismein Mufti saheb ne Kaha hai ke non muslim ko rasmi talukat ke binah per mubarakbaad dena gunah hai kufr nahi aur agar kaafiron ke kisi din ko baa azmat jaanke uski Mubarak baadi detahai to aisa shaks kaafir hai.

Mushfique

Very well said brother..
Khwaja ki nagri ki to baat hi alag hai yahan to har ek ko milta hai..jo maangta hai...Love towards all and Malice towards None...
but bhai masla yahan par alag hai..

Yahan to Ek Scholar apne chand gair Musalmaan logon ko apne ghar bula kar unke saath Christmas bnaa rhe hain.
And According to the Fatwa you have shared Which i am Sure is from a SUNNI SCHOOL OF THOUGHT that its Gunah and Not Kufr so i want to know why is this Scholar doing Gunah and asking others also to do it.

Also one person on this forum has said that NO Other Muslim scholar or Silisila does this...
Means he is trying to prove all other Sililsa and Scholars wrong..

Also it means that there is ONLY ONE SUNNI SCHOLAR in this world who has real understanding of Sunnah and Quran and rest all
have till not Understood Quran and Hadees at all...

This is absurd. I think the person favoring it is badly mistaken and passing on wrong information here on the forum.



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: masood on November 06, 2010, 11:09:22 AM
Quote
Admin se Guzarish hai ke unhone jo polling rakha hai usmein topic galat likha hai.
Admin ne likha hai topic :   Is it Gunaah to celebrate Christmas with Non Muslims.?
Jubke asli topic hai:            Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?

Ye agar janbujhke kiya jaa raha hai to fir no excuse aur agar galti se to admin ne kuch karna chahiye.
Mushfique

Assalaamualycum Wa Rehamtullahe Wa Barkathu. brother Mushfique.
As rightly said by one sisters that the Topic started of as "Is it Gunah to Wish a Non Muslim"  but Once brother Talib-E-ILM posted that Video of Dr Tahir Sahib then the whole Discussion diverted to Celebrating Christmas with Non Muslims and apart from the first 2 post all the other Post are discussing  the celebration of Christmas with Non Muslims hence the Title was given.

And it is a very broad title which shows whats happening in the Video and the BANNER clearly says Merry Christmas at the back  and a Non Muslim priest standing next to Dr. Tahir Sahib with a Big Cross in his Neck. so hence the Poll was Is celebrating Christmas with Non Muslims Gunaah. It means in their premises or in our premises any which way is it Gunaah or Not.




Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: RHS on November 06, 2010, 11:23:55 AM
Asslamalikum brothers and sisters.
Reading this thread which has gone really big now so many posts it took me one hour to read and understand the whole discussion and how it got shifted from one simple question...

My Age is 62 and i am not familiar with computers so please excuse my mistakes.

Now joining the Current discussion i would like to share my thoughts..

Some bros told me that Minhaj are sending leaflets to some of their Masjids saying its okay to let Christians inside mosques if they want to worship,
Which i thought ok..
But even if they want to worship Christ and celebrate xmas :o >:(

Shaykh-Ul-Islam Dr is a great speaker but why has he done this..???

I believe another Sunni Shaykh has given a concise answer to Muslims partaking in what is essentially a pagan festival.

For all the good work he has doubtlessly done I think issues like this I know many ppl who I would consider neutrals are putting off SUNNIYAT due to this.


Also Minhajis suffer from the typical illness amongst most murids indo-pak in that anyone who questions him is mocked rather than answered.





Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Ajmal Siddiquie on November 06, 2010, 11:29:26 AM
True brother "RHS" Many Minhajis have this attitude instead of listening to what you have to say they will start criticizing you and mocking you if you ask them something..


coming back to the topic..

There has been an article (in Urdu) which has appeared in a magazine called Qadiri Razvi (or a name along similar lines) which has been displayed on my local  Masjid noticeboard today.This article says the same thing as the leaflets that Brother RHS has seen, namely that Allama Dr Professor Dr Tahir ul Qadri has said that it is OK to let Christians celebrate Christmas inside mosques. Furthermore it also states that he has opened up Minhaj Ul Quran centres to allow this to happen.

I do not believe it is true and will refuse to believe it until somebody shows me irrefutable proof.

Somebody of Professor sahibs knowledge knows that, as lockdown has pointed out , that Christmas is essentially a pagan festival subsumed by Trinitarian Christianity. It celebrates the birth of a person who they see as the "son of God" not the person that we revere as one of The Beloved Messengers of Allah Subhanahu wa Ta'ala Hadrat Isa alayhis 'salam.

Although Christians are thought to be "people of the book" nevertheless if we allowed them to celebrate Christmas in mosques then to remain consistent we would also have to allow Hindus to celebrate the birth of Ram.

After all for Muslims it is shirk whether you believe that Hadrat Isa alayhis 'salam is "the son of God "or believe Ram to be Bhagvan.

To be fair then wouldn't you have to allow both?

I do believe Professor Sahib would be alert to all these dangers and not suggest something that flies in the face in our fundamental belief of Tawhid.



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: DesignJinni on November 06, 2010, 02:34:29 PM
Some points form a Sunni Website "SunniPath"... here they are

Gifts during the Christmas season
http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=1&ID=2769&CATE=138 (http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=1&ID=2769&CATE=138)
There is nothing wrong with accepting the gifts: these are not per se religious acts, but social customs.

It is permitted to give gifts during the Winter Break with the intention of strengthening family ties, though one should try on'�s best to do so in a dignified but distinct manner, in order to avoid falling into the semblance imitation.

Family Christmas celebration
http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?id=3632 (http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?id=3632)
Keeping family ties is an obligation on every Muslim, i.e. with one's parents. If wine is served then such meals or gatherings are devoid of blessing and one should neither condone nor participate in them except for the minimum presence that filial respect demands.

As for fasting on Christmas and doing a lot of dhikr in memory of `Isa, then no, one should rather observe all the well-known Sunna fasts such as every Monday and Thursday, the three "white days" in the middle of the month, or every other day; and one should do a lot of salawat on the Prophet, upon him blessings and peace, and convey the reward of dhikr and acts of worship and good deeds to him; and then, from him, to all other Prophets and Awliya including `Isa, upon him peace.

Christmas presents to non-muslims
http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=7&ID=12050&CATE=1 (http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=7&ID=12050&CATE=1)
There is nothing wrong with giving presents to one's non-Muslim neighbors, friends, and co-workers. Rather, this is from the sunna of being good to one's neighbors and others whom one has relationships with. [Mulla Khusro, Durar]

The Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) emphasized the rights of neighbors and those one has any kind of relationship with in numerous hadiths, and these do not distinguish betweeen Muslim and non-Muslim neighbors.

However, the proper way to give presents during these festive seasons, is to make one's gesture general or seasonal, rather than relating to their specific religious celebrations. Thus, one would say, for example, "Seasons greetings," or "Happy New Year," or other general expressions, as our ulema explain.

And Allah alone gives success.


As far as Tahir ul Qadri video is concerned, He invites for interfaith dialouge, the whole event is based on "Interfaith Dialouge" and was held on the day of Mery Christmas. Christians are Ahl-e-Kitab, whereas the Hindus or other idol worshippers are not.

The Banner reads:
Minhajul Quran International welcomes and wishes
Merry Christmas to Christian Brothers & Sisters.
Dr. Muhammad Tahir ul Qadri
Muslim Christian Dialogue Forum.


Merry Christmas ceremony by MCDF of MQI (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ep_uXec6fGY#)
Interfaith & intra-faith Dialogue is necessary for World Peace by Dr.Tahir-ul-Qadri (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3U_CULR7dDk#)


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Ajmal Siddiquie on November 06, 2010, 03:07:55 PM
brother GENIE,

I would like you to read the previous threads once again The Discussion going on here is not about Giving Gifts or Maintaining Family Ties and neither about Interfaith Dialogue.

The Discussion here is about the belief of Minhajis that celebrating Christmas with Christians is it Ok as done by Dr. Tahirul Qadri Sahib.

Brother i have gone through all the Answers from SunniPath website nowhere it says that its allowed to celebrate Christmas.

Moreover the last sentence says

However, the proper way to give presents during these festive seasons, is to make one's gesture general or seasonal, rather than relating to their specific religious celebrations. Thus, one would say, for example, "Seasons greetings," or "Happy New Year," or other general expressions, as our ulema explain.


But thats what is NOT DONE here..the Banner saying Merry Christmas is going against the teachings of Sunni Ulemas.

I hope our point is clear..


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: DesignJinni on November 06, 2010, 03:24:50 PM
Dear Ajmal, that is why I said in my 1st line some points  from SunniPath, not proof for its validity. i.e the statement from Sunnipath "Keeping family ties is an obligation on every Muslim, i.e. with one's parents. If wine is served then such meals or gatherings are devoid of blessing and one should neither condone nor participate in them except for the minimum presence that filial respect demands. "

Does this mean that if its fulfilling the Islamic laws then one can have family Christmas celebration? And even if you have a family Christmas festival with a non-Muslim parents or vice versa then surely there would be wishes such as merry Christmas.

The subject for the topic is "Is it gunnah to wish a non Muslim in his/her festival" not Minhajul Quran, and if as per the fatwa a family Christmas festival can be made and gifts can be exchanges as well... and things like a scholar "Tahir ul Qadri" writing Merry Christmas ...hmmm these things move the discussion onto a different level.

But to me things need to be more clearer then this... hence I am still researching .... No verdict yet :)


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Ajmal Siddiquie on November 06, 2010, 03:35:05 PM
Brother Genie.
1. First of all I would like to tell you that any Website starting with the Word Sunni may Not be a Sunni site..Like sunniforum.com (Is not a sunni site)
2. Yes the Topics started of with something and once the video of Tahir Sahib was posted the focus was completely shifted
3. For me just a formal wish to a non muslim does not have any problem but celebrating it DEFINATELY has problems

4. MOST IMPORTANT - Ok now referring to the SITE which you quoted..I will use the same site and will prove that its Impermissible.
Read this thread carefully.

Shaykh from the your site sums this up in one of his Fatawa: He states:

It is not proper for Muslims to bow down before such avenues of sin. The challenges to what Islam forbids being experienced by you give you all the more occasion to stay firm on your Faith. And should the Muslims living in non-Muslims countries (and they are not that few) could get to agree on not participating in such functions, chances are that non-Muslims themselves would be left with no reasonable option but to weed out such disagreeable practices from their functions. (See: Contemporary Fatawa, p. 292)

If the party or gathering is connected to some religious event of the non-Muslims, such as Christmas parties, then also it will be impermissible for one to participate. The reason behind this is that, by taking part in their religious functions and gatherings, one will be indirectly approving of their disbelief (kufr) and their religion. The Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) forbade Muslims to even offer their own Salat at the time of sunrise, zenith and sunset, for there was an element of outwardly resembling the sun worshippers.

http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=1&ID=2752&CATE=107 (http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=1&ID=2752&CATE=107)


See now all Muslim Scholars are on One side and Tahir Sahib on another.
For Minhajis the only sole Authority on Islam is Tahir Sahib but for the WORLD its not so...

Celebrating Christmas is certainly not permissible with all the Sunni Scholars of Islam (excluding Tahir Sahib.)

We have to favour the HAQ.


With All Due RESPECT to Hazrat Tahirul Qadri Sahab.
Still I have immense honour and respect for him but these actions of his leave a bitter taste in your mind...



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: DesignJinni on November 06, 2010, 03:42:04 PM
Ahmad Deedat & Dr.Tahir ul Qadri in Favour of Celebrating Mawlid & Christmas ! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DmsQZ5GI6f0#)
Dr.Tahir-ul-Qadri's Reply on Issue of Interfaith Dawah-Who is Padri?Tahir-ul-Qadri or Jahil Maulvies (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKJboKjqcbE#)

Watch the videos on the link below as well:
Interfaith Dialogue - Muslim Christian Dialogue Forum (MCDF)
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=16D7BBB2AE1584E4 (http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=16D7BBB2AE1584E4)




Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Ajmal Siddiquie on November 06, 2010, 03:48:12 PM
Brother your research is misleading you..
Dont You know that Shaikh Deedat is TEACHER OF ZAKIR NAIK.
Shaikh Deedat has called ZAKIR NAIK. Shaikh Deedat (plus)

Now dont take support of these wahabis to prove your point brother..

Shaykh sums this up in one of his Fatawa: He states:

It is not proper for Muslims to bow down before such avenues of sin. The challenges to what Islam forbids being experienced by you give you all the more occasion to stay firm on your Faith. And should the Muslims living in non-Muslims countries (and they are not that few) could get to agree on not participating in such functions, chances are that non-Muslims themselves would be left with no reasonable option but to weed out such disagreeable practices from their functions. (See: Contemporary Fatawa, p. 292)

If the party or gathering is connected to some religious event of the non-Muslims, such as Christmas parties, then also it will be impermissible for one to participate. The reason behind this is that, by taking part in their religious functions and gatherings, one will be indirectly approving of their disbelief (kufr) and their religion. The Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) forbade Muslims to even offer their own Salat at the time of sunrise, zenith and sunset, for there was an element of outwardly resembling the sun worshippers.

http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=1&ID=2752&CATE=107 (http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=1&ID=2752&CATE=107)


See now all Muslim Scholars are on One side and Tahir Sahib on another.
For Minhajis the only sole Authority on Islam is Tahir Sahib but for the WORLD its not so...

Celebrating Christmas is certainly not permissible with all the Sunni Scholars of Islam (excluding Tahir Sahib.)

We have to favour the HAQ.


With All Due RESPECT to Hazrat Tahirul Qadri Sahab.
Still I have immense honour and respect for him but these actions of his leave a bitter taste in your mind...


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Ajmal Siddiquie on November 06, 2010, 03:52:05 PM
Interfaith Dialogue - Muslim Christian Dialogue Forum (MCDF) or for that matter any other religion IS Very important
but that does not mean u make a Banner of MERRY CHRISTMAS and celebrate christmas.

if 2mrw u need to do a Dialogue with Hindus you will put a Banner "Jai Ram Ji" ki...:)

Interfaith dialogues does not mean you start favoring their religion..




Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: DesignJinni on November 06, 2010, 04:01:44 PM
SunniPath is neither a Brelvi nor a deband site.... its a neutral based Sunni website... having all the ulemas of the both jammats.

As far as Sheikh Ahmed Deedat is concerned his fiqh is totally different from Zakir naik, Deedat was in favour of Mawild where as Naik is against it... Leave the Wahabi, even the deobandis do not believe in Mawlid... :) where as Shaykh "Usmani" is also from the Debandi group, it is not that I do not respect him... some opinions may differ but these ulemas have my great respect.

Ajmal, I agree with you, not to celebrate the event "Christmas" itself, but again is Tahirul Qadri really celebrating this event? You just said "formal wish to a non Muslim does not have any problem but celebrating it DEFINATELY has problems"

I agree to the same, but if you see the complete video of Tahir ul Qadri it’s an interfaith dialogue not a Christmas Celebration. And just saying merry Christmas does not mean you are celebrating it right? As you said formal saying or wishing does not matter… plus hindu are not Ahle Bait, and the word Merry Christmas meaning itself does not fall in the same category as “Jai Ram Ji”

Please watch the link: www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKJboKjqcbE


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Ajmal Siddiquie on November 06, 2010, 04:15:10 PM
Brother..what is the Need to put up a Banner approving their belief in first Case..this Interfaith Dialogue could have been much better without that Banner and Much better not to be on Christmas day..

You still dint read the whole thread..Read what brother RHS has written...
These Minhajis are distributing Pamphlets in their Masjid about Celebrating Christmas to be allowed in Minhaj Centers and Masjids and thats True.

Brother the concept of People of the Book does not imply here...
The Banner was put to please the opposite Faith and if Hindus would have been invited then this would have been Jai Ram Ji ki instead...

I have listened to the entire youtube link..it talks about Rasool Allah  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam being nice to the King of Habsha bcoz he was nice to the Muslims and he provided Refuge to Muslim... RasoolAllah  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam also took care of the Guests himself and that what is SUNNAH ALL ABOUT...i agree with it..

But Nauzubillah Rasoolallah  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam did not encourage their beliefs or agree with them on celebrating their festivals.

A little more research on this topic lead me to belive that Celebrating Christmas on 25 Dec is not only a NON MUSLIM FESTIVAL but its also going against the Quran. On One of the forums i read... ISA  Alaihis Salaam . was NEVER Born on 25th DECEMBER or fot that matter in WINTER SEASON....

I also wanted to note that December 25 is not the real birthday of Isa I'm sure most of us know that it was a pagan holiday to celebrated the death of the son of the sun diety Ra, who also had 12 disciples and the origins of this date for Christians is that it was chosen in 221 AD by Sextus Julius Africanas as the birthdate. Biblically it is supposed to be the Spring or Summer as can be seen in the Book of Luke and not in the Winter.



The Qur'an tells us of the birth:



"And the pains of childbirth drove her to the trunk of a palm-tree......And shake towards thyself the trunk of the palm-tree: It will let fall fresh ripe dates upon thee." (Qur'an 19:23 and 25)

Scholars agreed that this event was a miracle as an average person can't simply shake a palm tree like that to get dates, yet Allah made it so! From this verse we get the idea that it was likely to be during the harvest season, which at the time could be in the beginning weeks in the Summer.

We don't know the precise date, hence why celebrating the Milad for Isa  Alaihis Salaam . would be difficult. Allah knows best.




Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: DesignJinni on November 06, 2010, 04:25:09 PM
We all know Jesus was not born on the 25th of December :) and am aware of its history as well and in the link which I provided of Tahir l Qadri, if Prophet Muhammad sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam allowed them to say their prayers and Christian ibdat in Masjid Nabwi, does that not look like encouragement as well that he allowed it?

Quote
"These Minhajis are distributing Pamphlets in their Masjid about Celebrating Christmas to be allowed in Minhaj Centers and Masjids and thats True."

Brother, "Celebrating Christmas to be allowed in Minhaj Centers" for whom -- the Muslims celeberating it or approving that Christans can use these space to celeberate?

Any ways no further Comments ... I rest the case for the time being...we both have our opinions and points posted for others to se… we are not here to dictate things  Cheers!


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Ajmal Siddiquie on November 06, 2010, 04:37:12 PM
Brother, "Celebrating Christmas to be allowed in Minhaj Centers" for whom -- the Muslims celeberating it or approving that Christans can use these space to celeberate?

APPROVING Christians to use these space to celebrate with the Muslims as was being done in the MINHAAJ CENTER where this dialogue took place.

No brother the Prophet Muhammad  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam allowing christians dint seem like Encouragement bcoz RasoolAllah  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam DID Not PARTICIPATE In these Acts NOR DId he ask the Sahabas to participate in those Prayers or CELEBRATION...

This is Clear proof indicating that such acts are Not Allowed.

Secondly the Most Important thing is

If you KNOW THAT YOUR ACTIONS are GOING  DIRECTLY Against the QURAN And still you advocate others to do it and
DO IT Urself then i guess You should NOW TELL me what such a person should be called..


But all said and done i still Listen to Tahir Sahib as i listen to Scholars of All Religions and Sects to gain knowledge...
And Will continue listening to him to gain knowledge but will never be a part of such uncalled for actions....


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: DesignJinni on November 06, 2010, 04:51:28 PM
Some more statments of Tahir Ul Qadri....
The Establishment Of Muslim Christian Dialogue Forum (MCDF) Shaykh ul Islam Dr Tahir ul Qadri (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tlVWSFKvss#)
(so far he is saying he lets christians celeberate, not that he clebrates it etc) but any ways ... No Comments :)


Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Ajmal Siddiquie on November 06, 2010, 04:56:17 PM
Read all the 74 posts and you will know how and where all did he ASK Muslims to celebrate Christmas...

Dr Tahir Sahib Himself celebrates Christmas and asks Muslims to celebrate it although in the Quran its proved that Isa  Alaihis Salaam . was not born in Winters..

This Act of his is going against the Quran..

You can ask any Minhaaji also this and he will explain you in details.



Title: Re: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?
Post by: Altaf Sultani on November 08, 2010, 08:38:28 AM
I just spoke with Mufti Mehmood Akhtar Saheb on this matter, as per shariah he said wishing
christmans/diwali is not permissible
..........