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Author Topic: Is it gunnah to wish a non muslim in his/her festival...?  (Read 33697 times) Average Rating: 0
mamqasmi
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« Reply #30 on: November 03, 2010, 05:04:09 PM »

MERRY CHRISTMAS kehna shirk hay jis k lugwi maanay main yeh hay k Na’aa’ouzobillah Allah nay beta jana – to agar koyee celebration karnay main yeh kehday to Tajdeed e Islam aur Tajdeed Nikah karna parta hay yani aap Islam say kharij hosaktay hain

I want to know that Which Category of SHIRK does it fall into?  What is the main category of SHIRK and what is the Subcategory of SHIRK?  If you cannot give the reply on the category of Shirk then I think I should have to Start a topic on the "Definition and categorization of Tauheed and Shirk".

When we talk about Allah Kareem – no categories will be there – SHIRK is just SHIRK nothing else – in every sense

Brother Muslims agar Hazrat Isa Alaihay Salaam ki wildat celebrate karain to maqsad kuch aur hoga magar jab Non Muslim celebrate kartay hain to maqsad kuch aur hota hay woh basically unkay mazhab k hawalay say Maaz Allah - Allah Kareem k betay (son) ki wladat ki khushi main celebrate kartay hain to khud batao k kia unkay saath milkar celebrate karna ja'iz hay

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Talib e Dua, Sag e Dargah e Aalia MASHORI SHARIF - Faqir Mohammed Atif Minhaj Qasmi Qadri
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« Reply #30 on: November 03, 2010, 05:04:09 PM »

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mamqasmi
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« Reply #31 on: November 03, 2010, 05:16:59 PM »

Brother at last - I hope u don't mind because these are personal points aur main to Allah Kareem ka sab say gunahgaar o khatakaar banda hoon - is aajiz ki kia majaal k Buzurgan e Deen o Aulia Allah k saamnay lab kushayee kar sakay -

Any way - I think we don't wanna discuss more on some1's personal - but aik baat zaroor hay k ahtiyaat zaroori hay k fitna angeziyun say bacha jaye warna shayad ISLAM/ SUFISM/ IBADAAT main TAQWA ki istilah nahen hoti

The best things is to learn more from everywhere..........not to criticize everyone...............but war must alwayz there when Gustakh e Rasool Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam o Sahab e Kiram Ajmaeyeen o Aulia Allah o Buzurgan e Deen talk about our TRUE BELIEF

Allah Kareem say maafi ka khwastgaar hoon k agar is saray mamlay main na danista taur pay koyee Gustakhi o Be Adabi sar zad hogayee ho to ae Bari e Taala too tou be payan Rehmat wali zaat hay - apnay karam say maaf farma . Ameen
Kind regards,
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« Reply #31 on: November 03, 2010, 05:16:59 PM »

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Nazneen
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« Reply #32 on: November 03, 2010, 07:12:21 PM »

very well said Atif bhai....

Nice reply...

JAzk ALlahu khair.
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« Reply #33 on: November 03, 2010, 09:50:25 PM »

Reply for brother with ID MSMQasmi:

As-salamu-alaikum brothers and sisters

I would like to go directly to the topic. Brother (Atif Bhai if I am not wrong) has mentioned:

Brother – hamain to bus Sarkar e Do Alam Sallallaho Alaihay Wasallam ka milad manana chahiye but is say murad yeh nahen hay k doosray tamam ambiya Afzal nahen hay – beshak tamam ambia Afzal hain

Reasoning: Brother what are you talking about? Allah (Subhana Wa Taala) has mentioned the births of MANY prophets in HIS own QURAN. For your reference.. pick up the Qur’an translation you believe in and look  for the following verses:

Birth of ISA (Alahissalam): Sura Al-I Imran; Verses 45-47
Birth/ Creation of ADAM (Alayhis salam) : Sura Baqarah ; Verses 30-34

I can quote you many prophets whose birth has been mentioned in Qur’an like Prophet Musa, Yahya, Adam, Isa, and beloved Prophet Muhammad Peace and Blessings on them all. I just want to save time for everyone reading these posts. All of us know this.. and nowhere does the Qur’an or any AHadis says that we should celebrate ONLY the birth of Prophet Muhammad Sallaho Alayhi Wassalam. We should be happy and celebrate the births of all beloved prophets.

You know, the actual problem is that we are not ready to accept ISA(aleyhis salam) as our prophet. We say it with the word of mouth but it did not show with our actions. We say it because believing in him is a part of Imaan. We treat him to be the prophet of Christans. Why don’t we all connect ISA Alehissalam with ISLAM. HE IS OUR PROPHET and he came to this world to preach ISLAM. He is not the property of any christen sect. If a group of people misunderstood his teachings then WHY SHOULD WE MUSLIMS CHANGE OUR BELIEF ON ISA(ALEYHISSALAM)

You also mentioned:

When we talk about Allah Kareem – no categories will be there – SHIRK is just SHIRK nothing else – in every sense

Actually this is no argument and is not acceptable. To declare anything to be shirk, it has to be placed into any category of Shirk. To help you, I would give you Three broad categories of Shirk and would like you to specify the subcategory. They are:

1.   Shirk Fil Ruboobiyat
2.   Shirk Fil- Uloohiyat
3.   Shirk Fil-Asmaa

And Trust me you cannot put his celebration on any catagories of shirk; because IT IS NOT SHIRK.

If you still cannot give the subcategory then accept that celebration of birth of ISA(Alahissalam) is not SHIRK in any sense; because it is mentioned by Qur’an and Allah Subhana wa Taala send Salaam on the day ISA Alahissalam was born and the day he will die being an ummati of Prophet Muhammad(sallao Alayhi Wassalam)

Rest whatever you wrote about in your arguments of defense on three tafseers and my replies does not Prove anything.

Yes of course I would take the question of sister in my next post and I have the reply for her also.
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ghaws786
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« Reply #34 on: November 03, 2010, 10:10:45 PM »

Reply for Brother with ID: Soldier of Islam

Brother you mentioned that:

What i think is what you are trying to do is Justify wrong actions of somebody by manipulating the Meaning of Verses of Quran according to your own needs.

Reasoning: Brother What benefit should I get to justify one’s wrong actions. I also have to die one day and face Allah and his beloved Prophet Muhammad (sallalo Alayhi Wassalam). What answer should I give to them if I support someone’s wrong actions? You prove me wrong with your arguments I will accept your point of view. If you cannot prove that accept that this is the Truth and leave your point of view. Whatever you believe DOES NOT ACTUALLY CHANGE THE LAW OF SHARIA IN ANY SENSE.

You also mentioned that:

Also why you choose 25 Dec for it Only bcoz Non Muslims are doing it and you will get a bigger Audience..?

Reasoning: Do you really think that he needs a bigger audience. Do you know that he holds the biggest Eitkaaf all over the World in the premises of Minhaj ul Qur'an every year after Harmain-sahrifain. Do you know that he holds the biggest gathering of Milad un Nabi(Sallalo Alayhi Wassaalam) every year at Minar-e Pakistan? Do you still think that he needs bigger audience? Be honest to yourself.

The actual point which we are missing here is what I mentioned in my last post that we are not ready to accept ISA (Aleyhissalam) as OUR Prophet. WE do no believe that he came to this world to preach ISLAM. If a sect of christens misunderstood him.. ARE WE MUSLIMS REPONSIBLE FOR THIS. We should not change our belief just for some sect of people.
The only thing which is left now is the question which our sister raised..and I think everyone is concentrated on that reply.

Wait for my next post for a reply on her question. Believe me, I have the answer, I am just holding it up to satisfy everyone else before I start answering that question.. which I will do at the right moment Insha Allah.

I would love to hear any other comments or arguments on my post; if there are any.

Wassalam,
Your brother in Islam
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Soldier of Islam
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« Reply #35 on: November 04, 2010, 02:11:01 PM »

Brother ghaws786 you are just trying to decide for us all the wrong things....

NO MUSLIM CAN BE A MUSLIM if he DOES not believe in ISA  (Alaihis Salaam)  or for that matter any other prophet of ISLAM.
EACH and EVERY muslim on the face of EARTH (from whichever sect he may be) believes and
Prophet ISA  Alaihis Salaam . is a Prophet and One of the Mightiest Prophet of ALLAH (Subhana wa taaala).

We Ahle Sunnah wal jamaat have immense respect for Each and every prophet of ISLAM.whether mentioned in Quran or not..
Even the 124000 mentioned by our AAQA  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam we have immense respect for them also..

But when you have been Given the BEST OF ALL THE PROPHETS..
THE LEADER OF THE PROPHETS to follow why are you leaving his SUNNAH and Following other prophets.
You are an UMMATI of AAQA  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam and till now you have not fulfilled his Sunnah 100% and you want to
please your Christian friends and follow their footsteps.

This is Absolutely not an Action of a TRUE SUNNI Scholar..

With Immense Respect and Honor to Hazrat Isa  Alaihis Salaam . I am again telling you..
You are forgetting that you are in Ummat of PROPHET MUHAMMED  sal-lal-lahu alai hi wa sallam and not ISA  Alaihis Salaam .


Loving and Respecting ISA  Alaihis Salaam. does not mean that you go to Churches or Attend Christmas parties ..
Looking at this the Innocent Ummah will be Mislead and thats what happening.....

He is just trying to mislead the Ummah into things which will lead them to MUCH GREATER SINS.

You have not even convinced me 0.1% that what Your Said Scholar is doing by attending NON MUSLIMS functions
is Good for the Ummah at all.

And ALSO I agree you will NEVER EVER GIVE UP in your Life justifying his Actions..
becoz i am assuming that he may Be Your PEER SAHAB ..And no Mureed would like to hear anything
against his Peer and thats correct also.

But we have to say the Truth and take side with HAQ and the
Truth remains that SOME of his Actions are against the Teachings of ISLAM and SUNNAH.. Thats all.

My answer remains the same
http://kgn786.com/forum/index.php/topic,19335.msg67281.html#msg67281
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arsh1226
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« Reply #36 on: November 04, 2010, 03:21:56 PM »

No Amount of Justification can justify this Act of Celebrating Christmas with Non Muslims.
In my personal opinion this Demands and Apology and a clarification for the Said Scholar.

DEAR SOLDIER OF ISLAM

I THOUGHT THIS WAS THE PLACE OF STUDENTS , I WAS WRONG ,,,,, THIS PLACE HAS TEACHERS  DEN ,,,,
ALLAH ALLAH  KARKAY DO BOOK PADLIYE  AUR CHALAY HI KAY ALIMOAN KAY BARABAR KARNAY
..........................

I AM ONLY FINDING CRTICISM IN THIS FORUM THAN UNDERSTANDING AND RESPECT(SPEACAILLY WHEN IT COMES TO ALIMS,,,,

SAB HUQ PAY H-------------- PHIR KAUAN BEHAQ PAY?HuhHuhHuhHuhHuhHuhHuhHuh??

BAAD AKEEDA LOAGOAN THO HAMARAY PUR HASANGHAY ,,,,,,,,,,,,,


DONT FEEL LIKE CONTINUING  IN THIS  FORUM...................

IT DOES NOT MAKE DIFFERENCE TO ANYONE, BUT THE TRUTH IS WE HAVE BECOME BAYADAB

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« Reply #37 on: November 04, 2010, 03:56:17 PM »

Dear Brother Arsh1226,
Every person on a Forum has got a right to voice his opinion in the most Democratic way maintaining the Decorum of the Forum.
if you do not agree with somebody's views you are free to post your views but we cannot get into somebody's mind and change his way of thinking.

When you talk of Bayadabi i will give you a reference of one post which is there on
ONE OF THE BIGGEST Sunni Forum of the world Without taking its name
 and has been posted by a TEAM member on the subject of Ecstasy and Mehfil e Sama.

Quote
The responses to the thread have amused me more than the video itself.
Seriously, how naive can you get! Some guy even set out to do "research".
Well whatever tickles you fancy I guess, but as far as I'm concerned, its a gathering of clowns whose beards weigh more than their brains.
But great comic value - its a maulvi circus! - I'd be willing to spare 2 quid to go watch that freak show live.

I guess this is what we should  call Beadbi.

I guess you are new to the Forum Culture, and have not visited other Forums to see a discussion goes into Hundreds of replies and everyone is given a fair chance to speak, My advice to you would be you are free to visit any forum and join any forum and also free to leave your comments on any post and so is everybody else.

Here brother ghaws786 is handling the matter very carefully and has given some very interesting replies on the matter.




Hazrat Sayyiduna Abdullah Bin Umro Farmata Hain Ka Ak shask Ne Mustafa Kareem   (Salallaho Alehi Wassalam)
Se Arz Kia ," Muja asa amal Bataiya Jo muja Jannat Mein Dakhil Kar De, To  Aap  (Salallaho Alehi Wassalam) Ne Farmaya  
" Gussa Mat Kia Karo Thumha Jannat Hasil Ho Jaya Gi"

Al najamul al wasat Bab alif ,R, 2353,jild 2 , Page 20



If you feel that a particular topic is hurting your sentiments and should be locked you are free to REPORT IT TO THE MODERATORS
and if Many people report the same topic it will be considered to be locked or Removed from the
Forum as decided by the Forum MANAGEMENT.


Best Regards

Admin
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ghaws786
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« Reply #38 on: November 04, 2010, 07:46:37 PM »

Reply for Sister Razia Warsi:

As-salamu-alaikum sister and everyone reading this post. I think this is the right time to reply to your very interesting question

Coming directly to the question which sister asked me.

I want to ask Hazrat Khwaja Garib Nawaaz  (Radiallahu Ta’ala Anhu). kabhi Koi XMAS party me gaye the..?Kabhi kisi Hindu ki Diwaali me Gaye the..?

Let me start from the incidents of the time of Prophet Muhammad (sallaho alahi wassalam) because his action becomes Sunnah for the ummah. If I prove the action of any Aulia-Allah then their actions does not become Sunnah for the Ummah. However  Aulia Allah also follow the Sunnah of Prophet Muhammad (sallaho Alayhi Wassalam)

Secondly, let me start from Qur’an itself because everyone should believe in Qur’an –e Pak instead of any other book.

Incident 1. : Qur’an mentioned the incident of change of Qibla in great detail. I do not have to give references and quotations for that. We all know that before and during the times of Prophet Muhammad (sallaho Alahi wassalam) Kaaba was in control of Arab Pegans which are a mix of  jews and christens of  Makkah and they used to pray at Kaaba in their ways.
At that time and before the incident of Tahveel-e Qibla, Muslims pray facing Baitul-Maqdis; until Prophet Muhammad(sallaho alayhi Wassalam) changed the direction and commanded his ummah to face towards Kaaba tullah and pray as we pray.

Reasoning: Did prophet Muhammad (sallaho Ayahi Wassalam) not know that jews and Christians were praying facing Kaaba since ages? (Relation:Do we Muslims not know in the present times that christens celebrate the birth of OUR prophet?)

 If Prophet Muhammad (sallao alayhi wassalam) knows that jews and christans were praying facing kaaba since ages; DID HE CHANGED THE COMMANDMENT OF ALLAH because a section of human beings were doing the same act? THE ANSWER IS BIG NOOOO. He asked his ummah to still face towards Kaaba and pray; knowing very well that there were many idols placed inside the Kaaba.(Remember that idols were removed on Fateh  Makkah). He changed the direction towards Kaabatullah (as they were facing) but KEPT THE METHOD OF WORSHIP SAME AS MUSLIMS. This is what I want to highlight; that we should also keep the celebration of Milad of ISA (Alayhissalam) and change the ways and start doing OUR ACTS OF FASTING AND ALLAH’s WORSHIP as we do on Milad un Nabi(Sallaho Alayhi Wasallam).

So now tell me; which action is more dangerous and close to shirk..? CHANGING the direction of Kaaba? Or Celebrating the birth of Prophet ISA(Alahis salam)? I leave it upto you to decide.

INCIDENT 2: We all know that Ashura is celebrated on 10th of Muharram since ages even before the times of Prophet Muhammad(sallaho Alayhi Wasallam) by jews and christens, because this day has high significance in relation to many Prophets. Jews used to keep fast on this day. Prophet Muhammad (sallaho alayhi wassalam) knowing that this day is being observed by jews; he asked his ummah to keep fast ON THE SAME DAY. Later on the incident of Karbala took place on the same day and this day is related to Muslims more than jews.

Reasoning: Why did  prophet Muhammad(sallaho Alayhi Wassalam) did not changed the day. If he wants he could change it to any other day; but because this day is related to incidents of many prophets he never did that and asked his ummah to keep fast on the same day 10th of Muharram. Here also he did not change the law of shariah in any sense based on the practice of some sect of people like jews or christens.

This is what I am trying to explain in these posts that the actions of jews or christens do not actually change the LAW OF SHARIA and commandment of Allah for we Muslims in any sense.

Now coming back to the question of sister: She asked whether any Aulia- Allah went to any of these functions? Then Why Now..?

So sister, this scholar (Dr. Muhammad Tahir ul Qadri) also NEVER WENT to this function. Just look at the picture and video again and you can very well identify that this celebration is being held in the premises of Minhaj ul Qur’an. He has never gone to any church or any party and celebrated with them.

He is just holding the Milad of second Mightiest Messanger of Allah Subhana wa taala in HIS WAYS at HIS PREMESIS. He is not doing any haraam act or any act of drinking or parting with music etc. or what christens does.

He is just trying to give a message to ummat-e Muslima to hold the milad of OUR PROPHET in OUR WAYS. And I think this is totally permissible.

At last.. I would like to mention some facts about me.. Because I think that some of my brothers and sisters might start misunderstanding my Aqeeda also; after reading my posts and my point of view.

Brothers, I am a born Indian, at present in Canada, and a Sunni Muslim. I belong to Hanafi madhab and I am not in Bayt with Dr. Muhammad tahir ul Qadri. He does not take any Bayt at all. Yes, Of course, I listen to him and he is one of my teachers. I am also a student of Shah Ahmed Raza Khan Barelvi (Rehma tulla-e Tallah Alay). Most of you should not know this that Dr. Muhammad Tahir ul Qadri is also a grand student of Shah Ahmed Raza Khan Barelvi (Rehma tulla-e Tallah Alay), with only one teacher between him and Ala Hazrat((Rehma tulla-e Tallah Alay).  I belong to Silsila Qadria and Mureed of Ghaus-e Pak Shaikh Abdul Qadir Al-Gilani(Rehma tulla-e Tallah Alay). I think this should be enough about me for everyone to believe that I am a sunni Muslim.

At last I would like to thank brother Masood Khatri for the comments he made about me in his post.

Thanks for your comments and considerations. I look forward to any comments and compliments.

Wassalam,
Your brother in ISLAM
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huma
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« Reply #39 on: November 04, 2010, 08:25:17 PM »

I am glad brother Imran thought about niyat.. which is the fundamental to Islam.. if we celebrate with guilt , it is gunnah, if we celebrate because u will make some one happy, a someone who si truly sincere but majboor, then there is no question of a sin..., well such conditional polls can bring conflict.no?
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« Reply #40 on: November 05, 2010, 09:16:32 AM »

assalaam alaikum wa rahmatullaahi wa barakatuh. i believe wish non muslimsand dont get involved in thier festivals. secondly someone criticised dr.tahir ul qadri. i feel we are no one to criticise anybody as we are normal muslims. hum khud apne eimaan k e kachche hain hum kisiko kya bura bhala kahe. QURAAN-E-PAAK AUR HADEES ko follow karo. apni namaz ko waqt pe pado. baakhi sahi bura bolne ka decision ulema aur aalimo aur renowned scholars pe rehne do.  my veiw is wish them and do not get involved in their festivals. agar hum pehle hi inko door karenge toh islaam ki dawat kaise denge. baaki ALLAAH SUBHAAN WA TA'AALA zyada behtar jaante hain
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Rizwan Maniar
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« Reply #41 on: November 05, 2010, 11:39:53 AM »

$ Arsh

U said ''People who consider shakul islam Dr.Tahirul Qadri(saheb)  as''GUMRAH'' are themselves .''GUMRAH'',,,

as far as the Hujjat ul islam ,stop it brother , its yours words or someonelse but its sound arrogant.

 Before posting any comments on shakyul islam Dr.Tahirul Qadri(saheb) make sure you understand what message he delivers and how qualified he is.
''

OK lets carry o here, kindly explain can a muslim attend funeral prayers of a gustakh e Rasool sallallahu alaihi wasallamn, is this the aqaid of ahle sunnah brother, kindly reply Huh, terming all sunnat as gumrah will not be tolerated in this forum , nrxt time b careful brother , ur lines r deleted


waiting 4 the answer
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« Reply #42 on: November 05, 2010, 02:46:41 PM »

As-salamu-alaikum All,

I think the poll question is wrong and posted in a tricky way. The question says:

Is it gunah to celebrate chrismas with Non-Muslims? whereas It should be posted as:

IS IT GUNAH TO CELEBRATE CHRISTMAS IN ISLAM?
OR IS IT GUNAH TO WISH NON_MUSLIM ON HIS FESTIVAL?

And I think this is what the discussion is all about. I would love to hear from other members..

Wassalam
Your brother in ISLAM.
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DesignJinni
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« Reply #43 on: November 05, 2010, 02:56:51 PM »

Assalam-o-Alaikum !!! Wa Rehmatullahi Wa Barakatuhu Wa Maghfiratuhu,
Quote
mamqasmi wrote:
aisa k MERRY CHRISTMAS kehna shirk hay jis k lugwi maanay main yeh hay k Na’aa’ouzobillah Allah nay beta jana – to agar koyee celebration karnay main yeh kehday to Tajdeed e Islam aur Tajdeed Nikah karna parta hay yani aap Islam say kharij hosaktay hain

Brother, where do you get your definitions from? Shirk tu loog asie use karte hai jese koi AK47 ho and shirk ki bullets fire karte jayo... and ye bi shirk wo bi shirk, har cheez shirk... I don't feel that to be appropiate. We should be very carefull in this.
Etymology (Christmass)
The word Christmas originated as a compound meaning "Christ's Mass".
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas

Christ: means Messiah (the anointed one) yanni Hazrat Isa Alaihay Salaam
Mass (liturgy): means Festival
& I think we all know what "Merry" means.

Plus so many christans religiously do not believe that Jesus is the son of God, but they have merry christmass as well....

So, I don't know how you derive the definition of "Allah ne bacha jana"? (Naauzuillah) -- from the word merry Christmass.


Quote
Rizwan Maniar wrote:
Infact a large no. of ulema has termed Tahirul Qadri as ''GUMRAH''

Rizwan bhai, leave the large no of Ulema and please list the top 10 Ulema's name and to which jammat they belong to i.e Debandis, Salafi etc and I mean the top 10 not the bottom 10 ulemas you find so authentic to label him as Gumrah!

When you list the names of those ulemas then a lot of things will get clear that why do they label him as Gumrah Smiley


@ Admin
I think yo also need to add another selection in the vote option as
- Yes
- No
- I don't know

Becasue I think i have not yet reached any hard conclusion on this yet, but would love to see Tahir ul Qadri explain on this subject, as he has so much knowledge and he sure can explain it in the light of science. Tahir ul Qadri was was not doing a a merry christmas party it was an Interfaith dailouge event held on that day to invite Christans to islam to tell them how much we love Isa and to shed lights on the event and on Islamic teachings.

Cheers & Peace
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« Reply #44 on: November 05, 2010, 03:02:22 PM »

Correction: but would love to see Tahir ul Qadri explain on this subject, as he has so much knowledge and he sure can explain it in the light of Quran & Hadith

@Admin,
I dont see any option on how to edit my post like I used to see before... where is it gone?
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Your Brother in Islam
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